Thread: Is rock music in decline?

Originally Posted by Ralfy

Actually, my arguments come from the fact that I've heard more than enough rock music. I think "long jams" and sidelong epics aren't "staple," more like an exception to the rule. From what I gathered, most pop music is around three to four minutes minutes long, use a few chords and several bars of music, employ verses and refrain, can easily be followed, etc.

This thread isn't about pop music, it's about rock music.

It doesn't take any more knowledge to enjoy classical music as opposed to rock. It just takes a pair of ears and a brain that is engaged.

Most of the interesting stuff in the rock world is happening below the radar of the infotainment media.


There are many excellent progressive bands making great music, and it's not all 25 minute epic fare. Try some groups like Thinking Plague, Univers Zero, Helmet Of Gnats, Frogg Cafe, Mike Keneally, or Echolyn.

There is also a ton of great stuff being re-issued that never got any airplay in the states back in the day. Check out the Esoteric Records site.

Countries like Italy have a huge legacy of accomplished rock bands.

Originally Posted by Serge

Superior? Maybe in terms of complexity and sophistication

Well, yes. That's what I meant. I shouldn't have used the word "superior" but music that is based on the principles of development, refined architecture, etc.. has more substance to me than melody-based music.

Originally Posted by starthrower

It doesn't take any more knowledge to enjoy classical music as opposed to rock.

I wish that was true. If you take, say, a Bartok quartet and play it to someone who hasn't heard enough music and to someone who's been more curious in exploring different kinds of music genres, ten times out of ten, their reaction to Bartok will be trivially predictable. Appreciating music is a skill too.

Originally Posted by Ralfy

Actually, my arguments come from the fact that I've heard more than enough rock music. I think "long jams" and sidelong epics aren't "staple," more like an exception to the rule. From what I gathered, most pop music is around three to four minutes minutes long, use a few chords and several bars of music, employ verses and refrain, can easily be followed, etc.

If I may be so bold as to inquire if you've ever listened to any of the progressive British rock produced by such groups as Emerson Lake and Palmer, Yes, Jethro Tull, and the Beatles after Rubber Soul? I don't think--in all fairness--that this type of rock can be placed in the same pigeonhole as in your above description. With all due respect--and, of course--IMHO.

the fact that we,classical music lover, can listen and enjoy rock music but not vice versa... actually should be handle in worry and negative thinking , is classical music *enjoyeable* by everyone? ;p

Originally Posted by KJohnson

I wish that was true. If you take, say, a Bartok quartet and play it to someone who hasn't heard enough music and to someone who's been more curious in exploring different kinds of music genres, ten times out of ten, their reaction to Bartok will be trivially predictable. Appreciating music is a skill too.

It is true. Knowledge is not required for the enjoyment of music. I went from rock to Bartok, not because I studied composition, but because I'm interested in listening to all kinds of music.

Originally Posted by starthrower

I went from rock to Bartok

I doubt you'd go from Bartok to rock though.

This thread isn't about pop music, it's about rock music.

Yeah, but typical alt rock almost always follows the standard pop song structure. You might say most of what is called rock is pop in disguise.

Anyway, rock is such a hazy umbrella term with so many bland commercial grey spots and niche extremities at this point, it's pointless to make sweeping statements about it. Nevermind subgenres that have practically disconnected and created their own insular idioms, like metal and punk. One must really narrow it down because rock is less of a genre and more of a marketing convenience.

I can't say I'm a fan of the "indie" fad, though. It feels like a disposable and twee reaction to the banal darkness of the 90s/early 2000s, and the best of it steals its tricks from Swans and krautrock.

Originally Posted by Argus

This thread isn't about pop music, it's about rock music.

Most rock music have the characteristics I just mentioned.

Originally Posted by samurai

If I may be so bold as to inquire if you've ever listened to any of the progressive British rock produced by such groups as Emerson Lake and Palmer, Yes, Jethro Tull, and the Beatles after Rubber Soul? I don't think--in all fairness--that this type of rock can be placed in the same pigeonhole as in your above description. With all due respect--and, of course--IMHO.

Yes, I have, but as I said earlier, I don't think they make up the majority of rock music.

Originally Posted by KJohnson

I doubt you'd go from Bartok to rock though.

Why not? I'm not a classical snob.

Originally Posted by Ralfy

Most rock music have the characteristics I just mentioned.

Well, there's nothing wrong with keeping it simple if that's what's most effective. I mean, if you have a three minute song with two or three chords that sounds great, why add extra ballast that would only ruin it?

I don't believe so. Commerical music has been shallow and worthless with a few exceptions here and there for ever but there are good rock bands out there for sure (depending on your tastes of course).

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R6oORTB4awM

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8URqR1MCt4o

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tc1aT...eature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tc1aT...eature=related


eh, I could go on forever but I'll stop.

Originally Posted by jhar26

Well, there's nothing wrong with keeping it simple if that's what's most effective. I mean, if you have a three minute song with two or three chords that sounds great, why add extra ballast that would only ruin it?

It's possible that this form copies short folk songs that are found in many cultures, i.e., what people sing while they're planting crops by hand or resting after a day of work.