Firstly I had Wolf, but got back problems as well...then I went to a violin builder and tried many alternative marques, the result was KUN after I tried a KUN several month which my violin teacher borrowed to me.

One thing I don't like with KUN: It is not that flexible than I want it to be. Wolf you could really bend, but I have problems with KUN to do it, I dunno, maybe I am inable...some future plans for shoulder rests might be bigger shoulder rests. I think they are too small in size. If you have it much bigger in length and weidth, and if it is made by more soft material, you might have less pains caused by shoulder rests, but that will be special made shoulder rests done for every violinist individually....(if this shoulder rests exists yet, tell me, I must try it..)

So far my dream of a shoulder rest.

I've never seen published information on how to properly USE the various shoulder rests, and have found that they are often mis-used. If properly adjusted, the Kun should fit snugly, and comfortably, as an extension of the shoulder, to support the instrument in the most advantagious palying position. They are also infinitely flexible, if you have the good one...the cheaper ones are not as flexible, nor as long lasting.

Anne

Thanks for the advice Anne. I also welcome you to the board, though it (sadly) is not mine. :P You should start a thread in the Members Chat section to tell about yourself. Leopold says that the shoulder rest takes away about 1/3 of the overall tone and sound of the violin. However, I do think that shoulder rests might have evolved just a little since his time. Plus my new one is only 1 ounce and is made of wood, so I guess it will be very good. I know that Heifetz' master class was made to play without shoulder rests in the 70's and 80's.

__________________
It is our imperfections that make us who we are.

How much of an improvement would one expect to get by changing shoulder rests?
I haven't tried many other shoulder rests.
Right now I have this Artino that I got with my violin. I have nothing to say about it. It does what it's supposed to.

__________________
IF I hit a wrong key its becaus i kind of like it that way.

Harvey, after you have played for a little while and gotten more experience, you will start to notice many little things that improve your playing in little bits. Also, like I said before, the shoulder rest takes away 1/3 of the total sound (projection, tone, etc.) from the violin. That is bad, and I think Heifetz knew a little bit about the violin.

__________________
It is our imperfections that make us who we are.

Can you please post here what it says in your book about shoulder rests taking away 1/3 of the sound?

Also, I believe that I have played for at least a little while, but I understood what you're getting at:
Almost everything on a violin influences the sound in some way. Now my question was, how significant is the influence of the shoulder rest compared to the other influences?

__________________
IF I hit a wrong key its becaus i kind of like it that way.

Everything matters, so you do not need to compare importance. I know what he said, but I will post it anyway just so I am one post closer to legendary viruoso. B)

Here:

The second important point is this: avoid resting the violin on the shoulder or, vice versa, shoving the shoulder underneath the violin. The placing of a cushion beneath the back of the instrument, in order to lend a more secure support to the chin grip, should also be avoided. These are bad habits, which one from the very start should carefully avoid, since they not only spoil the violinists pose in general, but-and this is extremely important-they make the player lose AT LEAST a third of the whole body of tone which his violin-be it a fine or an indifferent instrument, a powerful or a weak one-is capable of producing.

There. Straight from the mouth (or pen) or Leopold Auer. Please take his word for it.

__________________
It is our imperfections that make us who we are.

Thank you.

So you shouldn't rest the violin on your shoulder. Then where do you put it? On your collarbone?

a cushion, not a shoulder rest.
So, I think what he meant was that cushions ruin the sound. I agree with this and 1/3 is a reasonable number for this.
But shoulder rests that only touch the edges of the instrument (where the ribs are perpendicular with the back); I find it hard to believe that it would take away 1/3 of the tone.

Edit: and if he did mean shoulder rests, he would have to back it up before I believe him.

__________________
IF I hit a wrong key its becaus i kind of like it that way.

Wow. Sorry if I sounded harsh. I was in a bit of a grumpy mood yesterday. I do know that Heifetz told his students that they should either learn to play w/o the shoulder rest or else drop out of his master class. Also, all of the great violinists I know do not use them. I would imagine that a cushion would take away much more than a rest, but imagine those soft rubber holders on the rest squeezing the sides of the instrument enough to hold them there. Also, extra force is added to reduce the sound when the player pushes their head into the chin rest, thus pushing more on the shoulder rest and having even less sound.

I usually just dig the tailpiece into the middle of my neck very hard.

Cool, Baroque style! Screw the shoulder and chin rest!

...I think I'll take comfort over sound this time. :mellow:

and when I play baroque, my chin is on the left. (not that there's anything wrong with it being on the tailpiece, or on the right, or not touching)

My little one has hated shoulder rests ever since she found her first violin (aged 3). Unfortunately, I don't play, so cannot help her, nor can we find for her a teacher ~ offers from Gypsy fiddlers in Moscow, Eire & Germany ~ not much help in UK! Are hard rests or cushions better? I have a variety (left behind after her violin teaching father left) & a variety of violin sizes....

Oh my dear lord!!!!!!! GYPSY FIDDLERS!!!!! AHHH!!!!!

Please tell me you took their offer! Please! Gypsies are AWESOME!!!!! You MUST make one of them a teacher! I COMMAND you! That is my life's DREAM! I wish I could have bee brought up by Gypsy fiddlers! I am actually getting my left ear pierced soon in honour of them! I also wear many Gypsy-like clothes! Oh my god. Start a new thread under members chat and tell me all about them! I am on the verge of tears I am so excited. You must make one of them (possibly their king) her teacher, lest she will regret it for the rest of her life. Please. I beg of you.

I am thinking about becoming a Gypsy if I can find a place with lots of them and if they will let me. Really.

About the shoulder rest; just train her not to use one. It is a very rare gift for your daughter to be so young and not want a shoulder rest at all. Do not make her use one. If there is anything I have learned from playing the violin, it is that originality is one of the greatest things in life. If one doesn't need or want to do something according to the rules, they do not have to.

Hi Quaverion,
The Romani are great aren't they
I could take them not up on their offers, no way I can afford the 'plane fares, but, godwilling, after my moving next year I'll try to get Annon up to the capital for the odd lesson with 1 of them! To make you feel even worse ~ she was "adopted" by Loyko himself (Sergei Erdenko) aged 4 ~ told he everyone that this little girl sleeping in his arms is his daughter! He is purebred (tatchey kaulo ratti Romano), [but we are only zingari], with 300 years of fiddle playing behind him! I'd love to see you in kit, there are pictures around with me in my 7 layers of skirts, jewellry, bare feet..............................
I know not how to start a new thread in here, maybe you could upon the receiving of this. I rewrote a trad Gypsy origin myth which I could send to you ~ learnt from Loyko.
I have my own Gypsy cob (Vanner in the US) & traditional vardo, with a hunting lurcher & cannis (hens).
There are Gypsies everywhere. A friend of mine (Gadzho) has spent most of his playing life with the Romali ~ he's a guitarist. We have many festivals here ~ see if you have the Ustiben celebration (April 8th in UK in London) ~ the Horse Fairs & a Gypsy Jazz festival.
My daughter is now 8 , with plenty of fiddles around her, but no teacher.

All I can say is that you have my dream life. I am completely and utterly speechless henceforth.