well some instruments are too slow and some are too fast. I just cant beleive the ratings it got.

I generally agree with Gustav, but I think a blanket statement is too much of a generalization.

However, recordings I have do not have a tempo problem luckily.

,
Interesting that you say "MY" Beethoven, I respect you for that, and I respect your personal opinion and preferences.

However, there is one thing we should be aware of as listeners when judging performances of Beethoven, especially in relation to tempo. When a conductor approaches Beethoven, in almost every movement of every symphony he is faced with an immediate and difficult problem, both practically and philosophically. Beethoven's mm markings are "too fast".

There have been attempts to perform and record the symphonies at the exact tempos that Beethoven calls for (i.e. Norrington). While these efforts are interesting documents in that they give us an idea of "what it would sound like if...", they are hardly examples of standard practice or good music making. So then for a "normal" performance, the question becomes "how much slower is OK" before Beethoven's intentions become twisted into something that destroys the character of the movement as he intended it?

Let me elaborate. The first mvmt of the 5th Symphony is indicated at quarter note = 108. I defy any conductor with a medium sized orchestra (strings 12-10-8-6-4 or something...) to try that. It's almost impossible. 104 still sounds a little hurried, while 96-100 has become a sort of "standard". But when the tempo drops below 96, say to 88 or so, the music suddenly takes on a different "character"... it's not just slower, it begins to communicate something very different, sets a different mood. These things are very subjective, but very real, as a trained and experienced ear will pick up on it immediately.

With this said, the responsible conductor's goal then is to imagine the tempo that Beethoven indicates (as a sort of maximum), and then find out how much slower it can be done without changing the character. An incredibly daunting task, in my opinion the hardest tempo decision process in all of Classical music.

THIS is where COBRA has FAILED.

He has distorted the music through an abstract theory that does not come from within the music and completely taken away the character that Beethoven intended.

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Oh, the pain.....Bohm's version (with Gwyneth Jones) is my favorite BTW. I'm used to more relaxed tempi. But this was ridiculous!

Yes, I do know that Beethovens Tempi are on the quick side (actually I like the first movement of the 5th to be played quickly), But I like the structure of a piece to be emphasised generally, especially in Classical era music, (say from late Mozart to Schubert)...And in no way am I condoning Cobra..

But Beethovens music can be played successfully at different tempi because he is such a master!..

It's just as well there are some 235 other versions of Symphony No 9 to choose from, as listed on the ArkivMusic website, which is why I wonder why this rubbish version by Mr Cobra (which isn't included in the list) is even worth even talking about.

That should never be performed.....EVER! At least, not that way.

That was Painful.....excruciatingly painful.
Especially the 4th movement. That's not presto. The little 3 min. section of Ode To Joy that I have from a CD that has excerpts of that stuff sounds better.

However handsome Mr Cobra might be, it doesn't make him less unmusical. That was awful. Especially the second movement. And the first. It's supposed to be forceful, brutal and somewhat desperate, isn't it? This sounds like chamomille tea diluted with mineral water.

provokacia

The music in this symphony is supposed to be more like a celebration. I heard it
on a classical radio station here in Murry Kentucky. The orchestra playing the
symphony on this radio station played it with more like a celebration and very
jublient. This version is way too slow for it to be enjoyable even though it was
very beautiful it was too slow to sound right. I'm not really that educated in
classical music but I can still tell when a piece isn't done right. I noticed some
thing else wrong with it and that's the key I heard it played in. It was too slow.
The messege in this symphony should say "Let's rejoice with joy and celebration
of life. This one took so long that I got out my knitting project.
judy tooley

Do you mean it was too "LOW"?

I doubt that the music was transposed into C, but perhaps the excruciatingly slow tempos create an illusion of a lower key.

This now reminds me of another conductor. I can't seem to recall his name, but he has conducted the PROMS some, has curly dark hair, really goofy-looking and always conducts everything so fast and crazily that it just drains and ruins the piece being performed. He would certainly be in the same class as Cobra, as far as I'm concerned (though, ruining great music in the opposite way).

Yes, yes, I know that feeling.

For example, I believe that anyone viewing the youtube video http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VWfWd29_Qtc
will see that there is here is a serious problem when performances of this standard take place on the university level. The conductor in this video was quoted in as saying“The quality of our in coming students is very high and they are very hard working" in the university's Alumni Magazine in Spring 2006 .The performance on the video took place in spring of 2007, so the quote should apply to the students performing with the many ringers that are in this orchestra.

Yes it sounds awful! but full credit to them in taking on one of the most epic pieces of music ever written!! They can only get better..

Just passing by here, finding your comments in this thread kinda amusing.
Haven't heard it yet, but will in a couple of minutes... I am quite familiar with the 9th and have many recordings around. 1 of them I find really bad, out of 6, probably because of the recording equipment used in that case. The soundengineer must have been drunk or something. But apart from a bad recording, i am really not bothered by creative thinking in performing classical works. As long as they don't make rap out of them..

Don't know if this is the case here, the comments don't give any hint. I'm just writing this because I am really really bad (since birth or maybe before) at hearing a bad perfomance, that demands a dufferent thinking than i use when listening to say beethoven. But sometimes maybe. I can identify the patterns and also different notes in the composition very well, but lack a sense of "how is it supposed to be?" and also often fail to point out "errors" that my mind correct before the signals enters my frontal lobe. Or something. Maybe I need formal education..

Okay, hope the link doesn't ruin my sleep now...

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