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Thread: Granate's Bruckner Challenge - Symphony No.3

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    Senior Member Granate's Avatar
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    Default Granate's Bruckner Challenge - Symphony No.3

    No.3 Results:
    Trash
    35th: Horenstein BBC NS
    34th: Matačić WSO
    33rd: Barenboim CSO
    32nd: Harnoncourt RCO
    31st: Chailly DSOB

    Decent
    30th: Venzago BrnSO
    29th: Asahina OPO
    28th: Wand KRSO
    27th: Szell ClO
    26th: Matačić PO
    25th: Solti CSO
    24th: Knappertsbusch WPO
    23th: Skrowaczewski RSOS
    22rd: Haitink WPO

    Good
    21nd: Böhm WPO
    20st: Jochum SKD
    19th: Celibidache MPO
    18th: Gielen SWR
    17th: Haitink RCO
    16th: Blomstedt LGO (1p)
    15th: Haitink WPO (2p)
    14th: Barbirolli HO
    13th: Schuricht WPO (3p)
    12th: Sinopoli SKD (4p)
    11th: Karajan BPO (5p)
    10th: Kubelík Sony
    9th: Jochum SOdBR (6p)
    8th: Knappertsbusch BaySO (7p)
    7th: Szell SKD
    6th: Vänskä BBC SSO

    Very Good
    TOP5 (8p)


    Bruckner
    Symphony No.3 in D minor (1889 Version, Ed. Nowak) (Live recording)
    Cond. Lorin Maazel, SOdBR, BR Classics (1999/2011 Issue Edition)

    Huge, winning performance with controlled and paused tempi, thriving percussions and care for the highlights (opening, scherzo and ending). The only thing the recording needs is a more spatial sound, which Kubelík was able to get in his same Bavarian Audite performance.
    B-

    TOP4


    Bruckner
    Symphony No.3 in D minor (1878 Version, Ed. Oeser)
    Cond. Rafael Kubelík, SOdBR, Audite-BR (1970 Live recording / 2011 Remastered Edition)

    Terrific sound for an actual studio version that did not make it for RCA then. Such a good release.
    B-

    TOP3 (9p)


    Bruckner
    Symphony No.3 in D minor (1873 Original Version, Ed. Nowak)
    Cond. Simone Young, HPO, Oehms (2006)

    Warning: Excellent original version of the B3. The changes are notable mostly in the first three movements, but the weirdest is the Scherzo. Saving that, this is another top recording for Young and the germanic-sound Philharmoniker Hamburg, with that use of pauses in the first movement and the legatos. No strikes yet for Young!
    B

    TOP2 (10p)


    Bruckner
    Symphony No.3 in D minor (1889 Version, Ed. Nowak)
    Cond. Sergiu Celibidache, RSOS, DG (1980/2004 Issue Edition)

    Celibidache brand and splendour. Not the typical 89 Nowak. The management of the strings brings something unique, and why not, more Celibidache shouts during conducting. Is the BKing here?
    B+

    TOP1


    Bruckner
    Symphony No.3 in D minor (1889 Version, Ed. Nowak)
    Cond. Klaus Tennstedt, SOdBR, Profil (1976/2005 Issue Edition)

    Speechless. Sound-wise, performing-wise, shines over any other recording. It is the use of silences, the strength of the scherzo, the strings, everything under control. Do get this rare Tennstedt cd.
    B+

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    Senior Member Granate's Avatar
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    I wanted to give tribute to a very special recording though:


    Bruckner
    Symphony No.3 in D minor (1889 Version, Ed. Schalk)
    Cond. Hans Knappertsbusch, BaySO, Orfeo (1954 Live recording / 2002 Remastered Edition)

    The remastering does wonders in a mono recording perfectly able to pass over many stereos. It is one recording to really consider. Away from the top 5 but close, this becomes a reference.
    C+

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    Bruckner 3 is his first great symphony, IMO..

    Haitink/RCBO was my first exposure...it is OK, Szell/Cleveland, and von Matacic/PhO [A great Bruckner conductor] are good versions - but my 2 favorites are :

    Solti/CSO
    Barenboim/CSO

    great flow and contrast...the brass sonority is non pareil...unmatched...I give Solti a slight edge, he generates a bit more excitement esp in the finale. the final section is most splendid - one of those great "Bruckner moments" that he would develop further in his later works.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Heck148 View Post
    Bruckner 3 is his first great symphony, IMO..

    Haitink/RCBO was my first exposure...it is OK, Szell/Cleveland, and von Matacic/PhO [A great Bruckner conductor] are good versions - but my 2 favorites are :

    Solti/CSO
    Barenboim/CSO


    great flow and contrast...the brass sonority is non pareil...unmatched...I give Solti a slight edge, he generates a bit more excitement esp in the finale. the final section is most splendid - one of those great "Bruckner moments" that he would develop further in his later works.
    I second those.
    First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win.
    "Mahatma Gandhi"

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    Senior Member Becca's Avatar
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    If you haven't listened to the live recording of the 1873 version done by Yannick Nezet-Seguin and the Staatskapelle Dresden from 2008 - then I strongly recommend it.

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    Senior Member Orfeo's Avatar
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    I'll give Simone Young and her Hamburg Philharmonic an A-/A. Their take of this symphony in its original version is to me to most convincing one to date. The orchestra's execution is superb and Young's phrasings are very well judged.

    That said, I'm surprised Tintner is not listed (or even Carl Schuricht).
    David A. Hollingsworth (dholling)

    ~All good art is about something deeper than it admits.
    Roger Ebert

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    Senior Member Granate's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Orfeo View Post
    I'm surprised Tintner is not listed (or even Carl Schuricht).
    Schuricht is the 13th in the rank. All I could say about the recording with the Wiener Philharmoniker is that it was pretty good, detailed and with a nice sound. However, the Wiener sound makes it a bit difficult to stand out from other versions. Although he is the 13th out of 35, which is very good, the best Orchestra for this symphony in my opinion was the Bavarian Radio Symphony Orchestra.

    My Tintner list was reduced from 00 to 2nd, and I could have been encouraged to include the whole set, but my impression of the early symphonies compared with others... I'll pass. Sorry.

    The other considered sets I did not include were Barenboim BPO (No Berliner sound anymore, please), Barenboim SKB, Inbal and Janowski. Maybe I pick them in the next several months after I have finished the Challenge. I know it is not fair and many times I regret it but I based my selection on comments.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Granate View Post
    Schuricht is the 13th in the rank. All I could say about the recording with the Wiener Philharmoniker is that it was pretty good, detailed and with a nice sound. However, the Wiener sound makes it a bit difficult to stand out from other versions. Although he is the 13th out of 35, which is very good, the best Orchestra for this symphony in my opinion was the Bavarian Radio Symphony Orchestra.

    My Tintner list was reduced from 00 to 2nd, and I could have been encouraged to include the whole set, but my impression of the early symphonies compared with others... I'll pass. Sorry.

    The other considered sets I did not include were Barenboim BPO (No Berliner sound anymore, please), Barenboim SKB, Inbal and Janowski. Maybe I pick them in the next several months after I have finished the Challenge. I know it is not fair and many times I regret it but I based my selection on comments.
    You're right, my bad. Sorry.
    David A. Hollingsworth (dholling)

    ~All good art is about something deeper than it admits.
    Roger Ebert

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    Senior Member Granate's Avatar
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    Default Tintner on Bruckner No.3 and final position

    Quote Originally Posted by Orfeo View Post
    That said, I'm surprised Tintner is not listed...
    Quote Originally Posted by Azol View Post
    Many Tintner recordings of Bruckner's Symphonies are revelations. Especially 3rd and 8th. Cannot recommend those highly enough!

    Bruckner
    Symphony No.3 in D minor (1873 Original Version, Ed. Nowak)
    Cond. Georg Tintner, RNSO, Naxos (1998)

    Powerful and close to be outstanding even considering the lenght and the use of the original Scherzo.
    C+

    No.3 Results:
    ...
    11th: Karajan BPO (5p)
    12th: Sinopoli SKD (4p)
    13th: Tintner RNSO (3p)
    14th: Schuricht WPO (2p)
    ...

    From now on I will follow up the rest of Tintner's set until the end. If I am listening to those first Barenboim recordings of Bruckner with the CSO or Wand Kolner tries, why shouldn't I "suffer" Tintner then?
    Last edited by Granate; Dec-31-2016 at 20:16. Reason: quoting

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    Senior Member Vaneyes's Avatar
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    BPO/Barenboim (Teldec); Dresden/Jochum (EMI); VPO/Schuricht (EMI); SRSO/Skrowaczewski (Arte Nova).

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    Has anyone listened to Jaap van Zweden's version with the NRPO on SACD?
    -merlin

    What you see depends upon where you stand.

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    Senior Member Granate's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by merlinus View Post
    Has anyone listened to Jaap van Zweden's version with the NRPO on SACD?
    18th after Blomstedt LGO


    Bruckner
    Symphony No.3 in D minor (1889 Version, Ed. Nowak)
    Cond. Jaap van Zweden, NthRPO, Challenge Classics (2011)

    Rhythmic and powerful version with clarity and balance. The adagio could be improved.
    C

    For the record, this is a thumbs up for your point.
    Last edited by Granate; Feb-15-2017 at 23:20.

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    Senior Member gardibolt's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Granate View Post

    Bruckner
    Symphony No.3 in D minor (1873 Original Version, Ed. Nowak)
    Cond. Georg Tintner, RNSO, Naxos (1998)

    Powerful and close to be outstanding even considering the lenght and the use of the original Scherzo.
    C+

    No.3 Results:
    ...
    11th: Karajan BPO (5p)
    12th: Sinopoli SKD (4p)
    13th: Tintner RNSO (3p)
    14th: Schuricht WPO (2p)
    ...

    From now on I will follow up the rest of Tintner's set until the end. If I am listening to those first Barenboim recordings of Bruckner with the CSO or Wand Kolner tries, why shouldn't I "suffer" Tintner then?
    The original Scherzo is the clincher for me. I like it much better than the later versions.
    Hours of unrecorded, unpublished and unknown Beethoven works at The Unheard Beethoven

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