Thread: fidelio- quartet

Only beethoven can compose something like this. I love almost all opera styles. I love puccini, verdi, bizet, mascagni, bellini, etc.. But Beethoven is for sure, for me, in other level..
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iCBCeYjxZp4

I know, I love this one as well!

Ludwig Van is "in other level" in general, but not because of Fidelio, that's for sure.

Not a fan Aramis?

I worship Ludwig Van, but Fidelio simply doesn't belong to his greatest works. It has couple of quite enjoyable moments but from the beginning to the very end, there is not one moment of genious compareable with his string quartets or symphonies.

I'll have to side with Aramis on this one. I enjoyed Fidelio, but it is certainly not the greatest opera I've seen, and most certainly not Beethoven's best work. It is infinitely better than Wellingion's Victory however. (Incidentally, the YouTube link has been taken down. I'm curious what it was.)

Originally Posted by Weston

I'll have to side with Aramis on this one. I enjoyed Fidelio, but it is certainly not the greatest opera I've seen, and most certainly not Beethoven's best work. It is infinitely better than Wellingion's Victory however. (Incidentally, the YouTube link has been taken down. I'm curious what it was.)

I think Fidelio certainly has its problems, not the least of them the fact that Beethoven seems to keep trying to compose a symphony while composing an opera, and doesn't seem to entirely master the genre (his first and only attempt), but in spite of this, I still think that Fidelio is a great opera, and it is remarkable as a first attempt.

Remember, practically all the great opera composers have started tentatively and didn't reach maturity and perfect control of this very difficult animal until many years and attempts later. While Fidelio is not the greatest opera, it is certainly much better than most (if not all) first operas out there, including those by the consensual five greatest masters of the genre Wagner, Verdi, Mozart, Puccini, and Rossini (although I wouldn't rank Rossini this high).

Oberto is not much when compared to Verdi's peak. His second one was a fiasco. His third one in spite of the gorgeous slave chorus is boring in my opinion.
Wagner didn't even complete his first attempt, Die Hochzeit, and his first complete one, Die Feen, doesn't enjoy a great reputation either (although I personally can't say, I've never heard it).
Mozart's first, with the weird name of The Obligation of the First and Foremost Commandment (K35) isn't taken very seriously by even the biggest Mozart fan. OK, he was young, as opposed to a mature Beethoven composing Fidelio, but still, we are light years from his Da Ponte operas.
Puccini's first, Le Villi, is actually more decent than the above, but still, light years behind Fidelio and light years behind La Bohème.
Rossini's first, La Cambiale di Matrimonio, is not too bad, but come on, it's a minor work.

So, that Beethoven tried once and was able to hit the nail in the head in many ways and compose an opera that while not the greatest, is certainly among a select group of great operas, is amazing and attests to the man's great genius.

Remember, some 40,000 operas have been composed since the genre started in Florence 400 years ago. Of these, some 1,600 to 2,000 are said to be worthy of consideration. Of these, some 200 are said to be prime works, or 0.5% of the total number of operas.

Beethoven tried once. Just once. Still, his Fidelio in a ranking that I've read of top operas ranked for their innovation, influence, aesthetic importance, historical significance, and lasting popularity, is number 35.

So, out of 40,000 works, he tried once and achieved the 35th best. Pretty impressive, in my book. Another mathematical way to put it is that 35th out of 40,000 is equivalent to the percentile 99.9175. That's pretty darn close to 100%, LOL. First attempt, folks!!

I've always thought with longing regret of what we opera lovers have missed due to the fact that Beethoven was not very much into opera and actually got traumatized by the experience and turned off by it.

Most likely, if he had persisted, his third or fourth opera would have been in the top 5 of all times.