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Who's #1?

  • Friedrich Schorr

    Votes: 4 12.5%
  • Hans Hotter

    Votes: 15 46.9%
  • Ferdinand Frantz

    Votes: 1 3.1%
  • Hermann Uhde

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • George London

    Votes: 3 9.4%
  • Hans Hermann Nissen

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • John Tomlinson

    Votes: 4 12.5%
  • James Morris

    Votes: 1 3.1%
  • Theo Adam

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Donald McIntyre

    Votes: 2 6.3%
  • Thomas Stewart

    Votes: 1 3.1%
  • Norman Bailey

    Votes: 1 3.1%

Who is the Greatest Wotan of All Time?

8K views 24 replies 11 participants last post by  Music Snob 
#1 · (Edited)
We've discussed this a bit in recent days so I've decided to bring back an old thread topic, but this time include a poll! Who you got?

Post videos of your favorites even if not listed!
 
#2 ·
Vocally, maybe Friedrich Schorr. Dramatically, maybe Hans Hotter. But who knows, really? I'm always surprised by new discoveries of great singers/artists from the past. Many singers in the early days didn't make recordings, or could make them only in old age. The recordings were poor-sounding and the process of making them awkward and constraining.

Wagner's first Parsifal, Hermann Winkelmann, made recordings twenty-some years later and sounds pretty awful, but he must have been good in 1882 or Wagner wouldn't have chosen him. We can only guess what Franz Betz, Wagner's choice for both Wotan and Hans Sachs, was like, but he was evidently the leading Sachs of his time and was said to be still "flawless" in his fifties.

I chose Schorr in the poll on the strength of recordings he made, in his prime in the 1920s, of excerpts from both Sachs and Wotan. The man's voice was a human organ stop, and he was clearly a superior artist as well.
 
#5 · (Edited)
Vocally, maybe Friedrich Schorr. Dramatically, maybe Hans Hotter. But who knows, really? I'm always surprised by new discoveries of great singers/artists from the past. Many singers in the early days didn't make recordings, or could make them only in old age. The recordings were poor-sounding and the process of making them awkward and constraining.
That just about sums it up for me, to hear Schorr at his absolute best we are fortunate to have the famous HMV 1926-32 potted ring using the new "electrical" recording technology (microphones, amps etc) recorded extended ring segments at multiple venues over several year period.......later 1935-41 we have a few MET wagner radio broadcasts with Schorr, there is much to admire and learn from this great artist!

The latest remaster by Obert-Thorn and Pristine XR brings potted ring to life like never before.......
Anything before that is short samples made with acoustic recording tech



I vote for Hotter as best wotan/wanderer even if I do concede Schorr was vocally more solid, Hotter fortunately had far better sound quality during iconic 1950s Bayreuth festivals, and his ability to emotionally bring the complex and conflicted wotan to life, always making the character sympathetic and dramatically challenging, the depth and nuance of his performance has never been surpassed for me..........all that followed are in his shadow :)
 
#6 ·
That just about sums it up for me, to hear Schorr at his absolute best we are fortunate to have the famous HMV 1926-32 potted ring using the new "electrical" recording technology (microphones, amps etc) recorded extended ring segments at multiple venues over several year period.......later 1935-41 we have a few MET wagner radio broadcasts with Schorr, there is much to admire and learn from this great artist!

The latest remaster by Obert-Thorn and Pristine XR brings potted ring to life like never before.......
Anything before that is short samples made with acoustic recording tech



I vote for Hotter as best wotan/wanderer even if I do concede Schorr was vocally more solid, Hotter fortunately had far better sound quality during iconic 1950s Bayreuth festivals, and his ability to emotionally bring the complex and conflicted wotan to life, always making the character come alive and dramatically challenging, the depth and nuance of his performance has never been surpassed for me..........all that followed are in his shadow :)
Agree 100%. Another thing that I think is sometimes overlooked when discussing Hotter & Schorr is the stature & majesty Hotter brought to the role on stage. Schorr was hardly Godlike in appearance while Hotter was striking on stage according to accounts I've read & people I've met who heard him live. I think that should give Hotter a clear edge over Schorr. The impact of the character on stage should count for a lot imo...
 
#7 ·
Agree 100%. Another thing that I think is sometimes overlooked when discussing Hotter & Schorr is the stature & majesty Hotter brought to the role on stage. Schorr was hardly Godlike in appearance while Hotter was striking on stage according to accounts I've read & people I've met who heard him live. I think that should give Hotter a clear edge over Schorr. The impact of the character on stage should count for a lot imo...
Bonetan we expect no less that Hotter adoration with your HH avatar photo :)

But you are right the highly modern stylized appearance of HH in 1950s Bayreuth and his tall stature made him look godlike carved from granite......

 
#4 ·
I can't decide between Schorr and Tomlinson and I'm glad they've been mentioned as I thought that Hotter would be on everyone's lips. I would need to listen to their recordings to compare and decide. (Although that wouldn't be a fair comparison as the Wotan I have of Schorr was made when he was past his best and Tomlinson was in his prime for the Barenboim Ring.)

N.
 
#10 ·
Morris at least had the voice for the part, which is a lot more than I can say for most of those who've assumed the role since.

I saw Morris at the Met in 1993, and the ease with which he sang the music and filled the house with sound was pretty remarkable. Unfortunately, he was not a particularly good actor, and despite being coached by Hotter in the role, his interpretation was pretty generalized. That's also the biggest problem with virtually all of the current singers of the role - some of them have enough voice for the music, but those that do make nothing of the text. And others, like Terfel, who do attempt to make interpretive points, do so with voices that really don't fill out the music.
 
#15 ·
I just finished watching the Barenboim/Kupfer Ring and Tomlinson's comments re/ the production. God in Heaven help me: Tomlinson also has a GORGEOUS speaking voice! Melt.

In case you don't own that Ring Cycle or have never heard Tomlinson and Barenboim's comments, I wanted you to know that Tomlinson mentions that he performed the role of Wotan in that production from 86 (rehearsals)-92 and then further into the 90's in Berlin. So, if you want to hear the opinion of his performance by someone who was in the audience that's the time period you should be searching. I will certainly keep your interest in mind as I do my searching on the internet.

If you haven't seen Barenboim's and Tomlinson's brief comments, let me know when you will be online and I will record and upload that part of the DVD for a few hours.
 
#18 ·
Just for the h*** of it I am going to throw in a vote for Norman Bailey. I was reading a review of the Goodall Siegfried in which Bailey was compared on a par with Hotter. I don't have the technical knowledge to know if there is anything to it but I do like what he does there, also with Hans Sachs, so as I said, what the h*** :)
 
#23 ·
Does anyone know what lead to Schorr losing his high notes? Did this happen around 1933? How secure were his high notes before then?

I've been listening to the 1937 Siegfried with Melchior & I can't believe how Schorr completely ducks out of almost any note above an E. Sometimes he doesn't even make an attempt! Could a modern singer get away with this?

I think I'm going to have to purchase The Potted Ring to truly appreciate this fine artist...
 
#24 ·
Does anyone know what lead to Schorr losing his high notes? Did this happen around 1933? How secure were his high notes before then?
He probably lost them for the same reason a lot of singers lose them - too much singing of heavy repertoire. They were better earlier in his career, but high notes were never really a major part of his vocal arsenal. The Siegfried Wanderer/Wotan lies a bit higher than the other Wotans, and a number of successful Wotans in Rheingold and Walkure struggle when singing the Wanderer.

Preiser has a disc or two of his pre-1930 recordings, but the Potted Ring is probably the best way to hear his Wotan. Likewise, his two live Met Meistersingers find him in late form, but the fairly extensive excerpts that he recorded between about 1927 and 1932 are glorious.
 
#25 · (Edited)
After many attempts, it was Hans Hotter that finally drew me into Der Ring des Nibelungen. Knappertsbusch 1956 Wotan's Abschied. Everything about that performance knocked my socks off. He has such a unique timbre to his voice- it truly is in a league of its own, IMO.
 
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