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Thread: The TC Top 50 Recommended Piano Chamber Works

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    Default The TC Top 50 Recommended Piano Chamber Works

    Welcome to the TC Top 50 Recommended Piano Chamber Works

    This thread is a continuation of a project that includes TC Top 100 Recommended Operas, TC Top 150 Recommended Symphonies, TC Top 100 Recommended Keyboard Concerti, TC Top 50 String Ensembles, TC Top 50 String Concerti, TC Top 50 Woodwind & Brass Concerti, TC Top 200 Recommended Solo Keyboard Works, and TC Top 100 Recommended Choral Works. General discussion of this project can be found in the TC Lists thread.

    People can view a compilation of all the present lists here.

    The Project philosophy is summarized below:

    - The TalkClassical members with a wide variety of interests and experiences can reach a consensus on the top works from a variety of musical forms.
    - The process should lead to some interesting debate and discussion regarding these various specialized areas of music.
    - The resulting list will be posted as a Sticky Thread and may be used as reference points for both newcomers and long-time classical listeners to the world of classical music and to specific areas of classical music as defined by these lists.

    Those of us who run this project understand and respect the fact that not all of us enjoy lists and polls, but we ask that you refrain from criticisms here in respect for those of us who do.

    Round 0 - Pre-Nomination Discussion

    Before the nomination rounds begin, let's first start with comments, questions, and suggestions. We would like everyone to contribute to this process as all of your opinions are valuable to the end result of this forum recommended list and it is also an effective way to gauge expected participation for the remainder of the project.

    We must agree on the requirements for works to be nominated. In the TC Lists thread there was a brief discussion defining a piano chamber work. That discussion led to this list:

    Suggested Piano Chamber Work Requirements:

    - Works must have a piano.
    - There must be more than two instruments (i.e. no sonatas).
    - The ensemble must be a chamber group (10 or fewer instruments with one performer to a part).
    - Winds, brass, strings, or possibly other instruments can be present.

    Please feel free to comment on these requirements as they are not set in stone. Also the length of the list is usually determined by the interest and participation of TC members. If we reach 50 works, and enough people wish to continue, we can extend the number past 50.

    Finally, people can review the DDD list of the 140 “Greatest Classical Chamber Works” for suggestions. Roughly 30 of those works are for piano. If anyone knows of other lists that might be useful or if people want to suggest possibilities before we start, please feel free to post your ideas..

    We welcome all participants. Let the fun begin!
    Last edited by mmsbls; Feb-21-2012 at 21:12.

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    Senior Member Klavierspieler's Avatar
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    Yay!

    That's all I have to say.

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    I've never really been consistently in on one of these before. But I might want to. Certainly I'll have something to say for the works that I know about, and I also want to learn more about other works.

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    What's the rationale for not including violin sonatas, cello sonatas, etc.?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Webernite View Post
    What's the rationale for not including violin sonatas, cello sonatas, etc.?
    Personally, I would like to see a separate list specifically for sonatas.

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    Senior Member HarpsichordConcerto's Avatar
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    We can assume for the purpose of this that we are talking about piano trios, piano quartets, piano quintets etc. etc. but not sonatas and duos involving the piano, which can be included in a separate one. Is this a fair assumption?

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    Do works with harpsichord instead of piano count? (Corelli trio sonatas etc.)
    Last edited by jalex; Feb-21-2012 at 23:09.

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    Quote Originally Posted by jalex View Post
    Do works with harpsichord instead of piano count? (Corelli trio sonatas etc.)
    I believe they should be as this would be consistent with our previous bunching of keyboard instruments.

    Also, as other have stated, and as discussed in the TC Lists thread, this list should include chamber ensembles including piano (or keyboard) up to a certain size, but exclude duo or sonatas as these will be listed elsewhere.
    "Beware of listening to this impostor; you are undone if you once forget that the fruits of the earth belong to us all, and the earth itself to nobody." - Rousseau

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    Senior Member jalex's Avatar
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    So do we nominate the Corelli sonatas by opus number or by individual sonata? They are rather short, but a full opus number contains over an hours material.

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    @HC: Yes.

    Also we probably should use keyboard instead of piano so harpsichord works will qualify. If we get harpsichord works, we'll have to change the title of the thread and List.

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    How do you determine the max number of instruments? Setting it at an (arbitrary?) 10, for example, would allow some Brandenburg Concerti to be included, while excluding some others (if we do include the harpsichord).

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    Senior Member tdc's Avatar
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    Nevermind...
    Last edited by tdc; Feb-22-2012 at 06:12.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Llyranor View Post
    How do you determine the max number of instruments? Setting it at an (arbitrary?) 10, for example, would allow some Brandenburg Concerti to be included, while excluding some others (if we do include the harpsichord).
    I think that the Brandenburg Concerti (or any other concerti) should not qualify. Wikipedia says about chamber music that "it usually does not include, by definition, solo instrument performances."

    The question of the maximum number of instruments is not easy. If someone has a better way to specify chamber music, that would be great, but we may simply have to place an arbitrary limit on the number of instruments.

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    Senior Member HarpsichordConcerto's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mmsbls View Post
    I think that the Brandenburg Concerti (or any other concerti) should not qualify. Wikipedia says about chamber music that "it usually does not include, by definition, solo instrument performances."

    The question of the maximum number of instruments is not easy. If someone has a better way to specify chamber music, that would be great, but we may simply have to place an arbitrary limit on the number of instruments.
    That's why I suggested to be concise by stating the genres allowed: piano trio, piano quartet, piano quintet, piano sextet, etc. As for Baroque pieces, disallow the concerto (Brandenburg Concerto, harpsichord concertos etc), even though the original performances were chamber in scale but the intention was to showcase the keyboard as principal soloist, i.e. a concerto. Similarly basso continuo lines in Baroque pieces should also be disallowed, such as trio sonatas that almost always had basso continuo lines using the harpsichord (and cello/bass viol) to support the harmony, even though trio sonatas were obviously chamber in scale.

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    If anybody has tentative lists of works they think deserve to be on this list feel free to post them ALL ASAP. I have some listening to do for this one and I'll gladly take some suggestions for works to start out with.

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