View Poll Results: A Forum on Music Theory?

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  • Yes

    29 85.29%
  • No

    5 14.71%
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Thread: A Forum on Music Theory

  1. #1
    Senior Member Ondine's Avatar
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    Default A Forum on Music Theory

    Do you think that a forum on music theory for listeners can be a good idea?

    A forum where knowledgeable members can give 'listeners', clues and insights in order to appreciate orchestration and composition of a given composer.

    A forum where the why's and how's of what we listen can be explain in an understandable way for listeners; without value judgements.
    Last edited by Ondine; Aug-21-2013 at 20:33.
    'Small is Beautiful...'
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  3. #2
    Sr. Moderator Taggart's Avatar
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    In theory yes. In practice, is liable to degenerate badly.

    Maybe the best option would be a sticky Q & A thread.
    Music begins where words leave off. Music expresses the inexpressible.

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  5. #3
    Senior Member Ramako's Avatar
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    There has already been a suggestion for a music theory sub-forum:

    Music theory forum.

    This was more from the point of view of people who want to talk shop about theory I think, but the two ideas may be compatible.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ondine View Post
    Do you think that a forum on music theory for listeners can be a good idea?

    A forum where knowledgeable members can give 'listeners', clues and insights in order to appreciate orchestration and composition of a given composer.

    A forum where the why's and how's of what we listen can be explain in an understandable way for listeners; without value judgements.
    Value judgements annoy me a great deal when in the wrong situations, but I don't see that they can be avoided. They can certainly be minimised though. I will be interested to read pros and cons of this idea that people come up with.
    Last edited by Ramako; Aug-22-2013 at 08:43.

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  7. #4
    Senior Member deggial's Avatar
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    as the sole no voter on this poll I feel I should speak up. Not being a musician most of shop talking goes right over my head. However, I do enjoy it when it occurs within a specific thread, so that is the best format for me. I feel that, with a forum specifically dedicated to it, these occurrences might lessen.

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  9. #5
    Senior Member Ondine's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ramako View Post
    There has already been a suggestion for a music theory sub-forum:

    Music theory forum.

    This was more from the point of view of people who want to talk shop about theory I think, but the two ideas may be compatible.
    Thanks for the link, @Ramako. I am aware of that thread. It was more about members with wide knowledge in composition and orchestration analysis. The idea is an open forum where knowledgeable members can have a plain dialogue with those which experience is just from listening. Members like @violadude and @Mahlerian, between others, from time to time offer very useful insight in terms of composition aspects of a given composer where value judgements -such composer is best that such composer- have no place, IMHO.

    Value judgements annoy me a great deal when in the wrong situations, but I don't see that they can be avoided.
    I want to think that we can avoid them. If we focus just in how a given composer wrote music there is no need to judge his work as good or bad. More than that we can know how it was composed. We tend to like or dislike a composer because our very personal and internal experience, education, culture, biases, prejudgements, temper or individual emotionality.

    But how can be judged the way a composer wrote his oeuvre? Far from judging the oeuvre we can learn a lot knowing why Beethoven sounds the way he sounds and Bach sounds the way he sounds in terms of orchestration.

    For example, @violadude told -in a Shubert and Shumann thread- that Shumann did this and that in terms of modulation. That is really interesting and it is beyond value judgements. Shumann did that. That is all. Another story is if you like or dislike him. That is a personal issue located in the mind, but not in the score.

    They can certainly be minimised though.
    Yes, I think so.
    'Small is Beautiful...'
    Leopold Kohr
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    English isn't my mother language... please be patient.

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  11. #6
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    I think it would be a good idea if the ideas were presented clearly, with examples referenced in YouTube videos. One thing I don't like about scholarly articles is, they'll say, for example, "Schumann had a unique way with [insert modulation here]," then they give a complicated piano score which I can't hope to play as an example, so I haven't a clue what they're talking about.

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  13. #7
    Senior Member Ondine's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Manxfeeder View Post
    I think it would be a good idea if the ideas were presented clearly, with examples referenced in YouTube videos. One thing I don't like about scholarly articles is, they'll say, for example, "Schumann had a unique way with [insert modulation here]," then they give a complicated piano score which I can't hope to play as an example, so I haven't a clue what they're talking about.
    YouTube videos are a good idea. I don't mean to have a scholarly cathedra but insight into the composer avoiding the useless value judgements about 'such and such is best than such and such who is carp.

    For example, the 'modulation' aspect explained in the quoted thread is important because it helps to clarify what romanticism is about in terms of orchestration and not the urban legends here and there told around a composer about his emotional life.

    I think -not being an expert- that from the score we can know why a given composer sounds the way it sounds and not from the speculations around his life.

    Of course this is a very personal point of view because what matters to me is music, not the suppositions about a given composer's life.

    But anyway, this is open to debate; never pretending to impose a personal view.
    Last edited by Ondine; Aug-23-2013 at 03:06.
    'Small is Beautiful...'
    Leopold Kohr
    ------
    English isn't my mother language... please be patient.

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  15. #8
    Senior Member deggial's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ondine View Post
    For example, the 'modulation' aspect explained in the quoted thread is important because it helps to clarify what romanticism is about in terms of orchestration and not the urban legends here and there told around a composer about his emotional life.

    I think -not being an expert- that from the score we can know why a given composer sounds the way it sounds and not from the speculations around his life.

    Of course this is a very personal point of view because what matters to me is music, not the suppositions about a given composer's life.
    don't be hatin' maybe we should also have a forum for speculations such as those, and hand it to bellbottom for moderation.

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  17. #9
    Senior Member Weston's Avatar
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    I find the contributions from knowledgeable people about music theory interesting. They help to clarify points of interest about specific compositions, but that's where I'd be most likely to read them -- discussions about specific works. I'm not sure I'd bother going to a separate thread for it. Of course, others may.

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    Sr. Moderator Taggart's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by deggial View Post
    don't be hatin' maybe we should also have a forum for speculations such as those, and hand it to bellbottom for moderation.
    Second that. .
    Music begins where words leave off. Music expresses the inexpressible.

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  21. #11
    Senior Member Eschbeg's Avatar
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    I'm not terribly worried that a music theory forum would be beyond the grasp of some users. The Woodwind and Brass forum is beyond my grasp but I don't feel unwelcome because of that. There are plenty of other discussions here, so the fact that I can't contribute meaningfully to "Rotary vs. Piston Valve Trumpet" thread is no great discouragement to me; I can simply refrain from reading that one. I'm sure users not well versed in music theory could do the same if there were a music theory forum.

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