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Thread: Richard Wagner

  1. #181
    Senior Member Rogerx's Avatar
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    Default Richard Wagner born 22th May 1813

    “Never argue with an idiot. They will drag you down to their level and beat you with experience.” ― Mark Twain

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    Senior Member Itullian's Avatar
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    Happy belated birthday maestro.
    Thank you for all the unbelievable great music.
    When all else fails, listen to Thick as a Brick.

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    I like R. Strauss much better than Wagner.

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    Quote Originally Posted by millionrainbows View Post
    I like R. Strauss much better than Wagner.
    Yeah I think I do too, in terms of Strauss's operas vs. Wagner's, but I don't know either well enough to say that with any real certainty. But Strauss also seems to have been more versatile, having written a lot of orchestral and other music in addition to his many great operas.

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    Quote Originally Posted by flamencosketches View Post
    Yeah I think I do too, in terms of Strauss's operas vs. Wagner's, but I don't know either well enough to say that with any real certainty. But Strauss also seems to have been more versatile, having written a lot of orchestral and other music in addition to his many great operas.
    I was convinced when I heard the Ariadne auf Naxos/Sinopoli. The ending of it is just magic.

  11. #187
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    I believe this is a thread about Wager, not Strauss.
    “Never argue with an idiot. They will drag you down to their level and beat you with experience.” ― Mark Twain

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  13. #188
    Senior Member annaw's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by flamencosketches View Post
    Yeah I think I do too, in terms of Strauss's operas vs. Wagner's, but I don't know either well enough to say that with any real certainty. But Strauss also seems to have been more versatile, having written a lot of orchestral and other music in addition to his many great operas.
    Wagner actually intended to write a symphony after he had finished Parsifal but, after all, he was still a mere mortal and wasn't able to write any purely symphonic music in his musically mature years, despite a few exceptions like Sigfried Idyll. With him, I feel, the subject material was also immensely important and the idea of Gesamtkunstwerk could be put into practice in opera significantly better than in symphonic music.

    Wagner's operas are immensely complex works of art, the other aspects that complement the music should certainly not be disregarded. He worked very hard on his libretti and I haven't yet read an opera libretto that in its complexity and philosophically complex ideas would come near to Wagner's.
    Last edited by annaw; Jun-04-2020 at 00:19.

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    From a customer review:
    I don't understand why some reviewers would give this magnificent recording less than five stars, because the cast, the conductor, and the orchestra are caught at the top of their game! Even if Giuseppe Sinopoli were replaced by a lesser conductor and the orchestra had been the Bavarian Radio or the RAI Symphony, the vocal forces assembled around this Ariadne are simply sensational! Best of the lot is Deborah Voigt's Ariadne, who is in my opinion the best soprano to have ever sung the part. It lacks the self-conscious, academic interpretation of Schwarzkopf and the indulgent jazz swoops of Jessye Norman, but that is all for the better considering how Voigt gets into the part of the character. Her luscious, silvery, creamy voice works wonders for the part of the prima donna, and her Ariadne is sung with a sense of Grecian abandon unheard in sopranos before her. I would say that this perhaps is the best recording of her discography, and brava to Deborah Voigt for making a specialty out of this role!

    Voigt is partnered by the likes of Ben Heppner, Dessay, Von Otter, and Dohmen, artists of a prime calibre who are able to bring an interpretive grain to their music. Ben Heppner's large, heroic timbre fits Bacchus' high-lying, difficult music perfectly, and it is wonderful to know that he has finally overcome that vocal crisis of his so that he can once again share that voice of his with us. I don't think I've ever heard Bacchus sung better by any tenor except James King. Natalie Dessay is a three-dimensional Zerbinetta with sexiness, naughtiness, and warmth, and she is also equipped with all the coloratura in the world to perform the part's difficult pyrotechnics. Her transformation in the opera is a portrayal of this great artist's skill in turning this essentially cardboard role into a character full of life, wisdom, and compassion. I would take her Zerbinetta any day over Gruberova! Von Otter is sensational as the Composer, her chiaroscuro timbre portraying the polar temperament of this character. Although she would never erase the memories of Tatiana Troyanos, von Otter is nonetheless a prime interpreter of the part with a knack for uncovering the dramatic nuances of the part. Albert Dohmen is a vocally endowed music-master, better than the dry-voiced Fischer-Dieskau in his recording with Masur.

    Of course, this recording would not achieve its legendary status without Sinopoli and the Dresden forces, perhaps the greatest Straussian orchestra in the world. Sinopoli conducts the score with outstanding clarity, movement, and verve, every instrument speaking out of the pages with an Italianate passion that only he could bring to the score. Oh that we would hope that he had lived longer to conduct Die Liebe der Danae with this team!

    In short, this recording is highly recommended!

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    Senior Member Woodduck's Avatar
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    I drop in on this thread about Wagner and find a review of a recording of Ariadne auf Naxos.

    ?
    Last edited by Woodduck; Jun-13-2020 at 19:04.

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  18. #191
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    Quote Originally Posted by annaw View Post
    wagner actually intended to write a symphony after he had finished parsifal but, after all, he was still a mere mortal and wasn't able to write any purely symphonic music in his musically mature years, despite a few exceptions like sigfried idyll. With him, i feel, the subject material was also immensely important and the idea of gesamtkunstwerk could be put into practice in opera significantly better than in symphonic music.

    Wagner's operas are immensely complex works of art, the other aspects that complement the music should certainly not be disregarded. he worked very hard on his libretti and i haven't yet read an opera libretto that in its complexity and philosophically complex ideas would come near to wagner's.


    YES!!!! ................
    Last edited by Itullian; Jun-13-2020 at 19:01.
    When all else fails, listen to Thick as a Brick.

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  20. #192
    Senior Member Woodduck's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by hammeredklavier View Post
    Richard Wagner (22 May 1813 – 13 February 1883)

    Thanks. Some really interesting remarks, entertaining and moving, that begin to scratch the surface of Wagner's position in Western culture.

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  22. #193
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    Quote Originally Posted by millionrainbows View Post
    From a customer review:
    I don't understand why some reviewers would give this magnificent recording less than five stars, because the cast, the conductor, and the orchestra are caught at the top of their game! Even if Giuseppe Sinopoli were replaced by a lesser conductor and the orchestra had been the Bavarian Radio or the RAI Symphony, the vocal forces assembled around this Ariadne are simply sensational! Best of the lot is Deborah Voigt's Ariadne, who is in my opinion the best soprano to have ever sung the part. It lacks the self-conscious, academic interpretation of Schwarzkopf and the indulgent jazz swoops of Jessye Norman, but that is all for the better considering how Voigt gets into the part of the character. Her luscious, silvery, creamy voice works wonders for the part of the prima donna, and her Ariadne is sung with a sense of Grecian abandon unheard in sopranos before her. I would say that this perhaps is the best recording of her discography, and brava to Deborah Voigt for making a specialty out of this role!

    Voigt is partnered by the likes of Ben Heppner, Dessay, Von Otter, and Dohmen, artists of a prime calibre who are able to bring an interpretive grain to their music. Ben Heppner's large, heroic timbre fits Bacchus' high-lying, difficult music perfectly, and it is wonderful to know that he has finally overcome that vocal crisis of his so that he can once again share that voice of his with us. I don't think I've ever heard Bacchus sung better by any tenor except James King. Natalie Dessay is a three-dimensional Zerbinetta with sexiness, naughtiness, and warmth, and she is also equipped with all the coloratura in the world to perform the part's difficult pyrotechnics. Her transformation in the opera is a portrayal of this great artist's skill in turning this essentially cardboard role into a character full of life, wisdom, and compassion. I would take her Zerbinetta any day over Gruberova! Von Otter is sensational as the Composer, her chiaroscuro timbre portraying the polar temperament of this character. Although she would never erase the memories of Tatiana Troyanos, von Otter is nonetheless a prime interpreter of the part with a knack for uncovering the dramatic nuances of the part. Albert Dohmen is a vocally endowed music-master, better than the dry-voiced Fischer-Dieskau in his recording with Masur.

    Of course, this recording would not achieve its legendary status without Sinopoli and the Dresden forces, perhaps the greatest Straussian orchestra in the world. Sinopoli conducts the score with outstanding clarity, movement, and verve, every instrument speaking out of the pages with an Italianate passion that only he could bring to the score. Oh that we would hope that he had lived longer to conduct Die Liebe der Danae with this team!

    In short, this recording is highly recommended!
    Wrong thread. There are many Strauss threads in which this would be apposite. But when did that ever stop you MR?
    "...it is said that first your heart sings, then you play. I think if it is not like that, then it is only just combination of notes, isn't it? " - Pandit Nikhil Banerjee, Master of the Sitar.

    ‘When in trouble, when in doubt, run in circles, scream and shout!‘

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  24. #194
    Senior Member Woodduck's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Barbebleu View Post
    Wrong thread. There are many Strauss threads in which this would be apposite. But when did that ever stop you MR?
    It wasn't a mistake. It's trolling, and another ploy to get attention.
    Last edited by Woodduck; Jun-13-2020 at 21:09.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Woodduck View Post
    It wasn't a mistake. It's trolling, and another ploy to get attention.
    What do you think of Parsifal?

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