Results 1 to 15 of 15

Thread: Strange music

  1. #1
    Senior Member Levanda's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2014
    Posts
    116
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default Strange music

    I was listened John Cage Music of Changes 1951. I did not gave my satisfaction, for my listening skills it was no melody and nothing intellectual and strange to my understandings. I thought I can do like that just press piano keys and something will come out. My excuses for to be so critical, I just wish to understand more about music. Would somebody open my mind. Many thanks.

  2. Likes Itullian, hpowders, Figleaf liked this post
  3. #2
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Posts
    14,039
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    I liked it, though it didn't need to be 44 minutes.

    I relate to abstract (painting, music, dance, etc.) as something to temporarily take you away from the norm. Mind stretching via their unpredictability.
    You're not being held hostage.

  4. Likes Levanda, AdmiralSilver liked this post
  5. #3
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    May 2014
    Location
    Paradise, Montana ... on
    Posts
    2,513
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Levanda View Post
    I was listened John Cage Music of Changes 1951. I did not gave my satisfaction, for my listening skills it was no melody and nothing intellectual and strange to my understandings. I thought I can do like that just press piano keys and something will come out. My excuses for to be so critical, I just wish to understand more about music. Would somebody open my mind. Many thanks.
    Quote Originally Posted by Vaneyes View Post
    I liked it, though it didn't need to be 44 minutes.

    I relate to abstract (painting, music, dance, etc.) as something to temporarily take you away from the norm. Mind stretching via their unpredictability.
    You're not being held hostage.
    Vaneyes makes a good point about relating to abstract art. Cage is the musical equivalent of abstract painting. It isn't a picture of any sort of reality. Rather, it's a completely new "vision" from the mind of the artist.

    Could you do something similar by clanking down piano keys at random for 40 some minutes? Sure. And you should probably give it a try. It may be the same sort of stress reliever that the Cage piece is ... or maybe it will provoke stress. Either way, if you get something out of the experience (whether it is from listening to the Cage piece or banging out your own "music") you will have done something worthwhile. Cage most probably would agree.

    In fact, Cage would probably encourage you to bang out your own piece rather than listen to a recording of his. Cage was rather against recording for the reason that it tended to solidify something that should remain fluid and malleable, that is, capable of "change".

    To hear the Cage Music of Strangeness ... er Changes ... I cracked into my 18 CD box set from MDG (613-1731-2) of the JOHN CAGE COMPLETE PIANO MUSIC performed by Steffen Schleiermacher. I found it on disc number 6. I'm listening to it as I type.

    Generally I like to give total concentration to the music, but occasionally I make exceptions, and again I don't think Cage would mind allowing for some other activity to occupy one's concentration while the Music of Changes rumbled on in the background.

    The nifty thing about this music is that it's a pretty good representation of contemporary/modern music piano plunking, and it may be the only modern piano music album the non-devotee needs. I hear a little bit of nearly everything in there: strings being stroked in an arpeggio manner, the shell of the piano being struck, 12-tone like phrasings, minimalist like phrasings, Messiaen like bird calls, Boulez like chord clusters .... If you like this piece, you'll like a lot of the abstract styled modern piano music. If you don't like this piece, you're probably better to stick with Beethoven, Chopin, Liszt and Rachmaninoff. After all, they have plenty of music to explore -- enough to exhaust a lifetime of study and listening.

    But I like the Cage piece (which is why I invested in the 18 CD box set in the first place). I also regularly listen to piano music of the atonalists and to Boulez's three sonatas and the bird song piano music of Messiaen ... along with much else. Fascinating stuff. Not to everybody's tastes, I'm aware, but intriguing to me and many others. I'm glad we have this stuff available to hear.

    But if we didn't, I'd probably go to the old piano and chunk some of it out for myself. After all, should I attempt to play a sonata by Mozart or Beethoven, it would tend to sound closer to Cage's Music of Changes than to what Mozart or Beethoven had expected to hear from their scores. Which is why Music of Changes is a good title for such sounds as Cage makes. For I make such sounds when I attempt Mozart or Beethoven.

    Which makes me wonder what I might produce attempting to play the Music of Changes by Cage!



    By the way ... here's a wonderful website devoted to a review and samples from that box set: http://www.allmusic.com/album/john-c...0-mw0001845330
    Last edited by SONNET CLV; Oct-14-2014 at 01:59.

  6. Likes Levanda, SimonNZ liked this post
  7. #4
    Senior Member millionrainbows's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2012
    Location
    USA
    Posts
    13,624
    Post Thanks / Like
    Blog Entries
    137

    Default

    John Cage is a native-born American, so he understands the oriental approach, and thus has no wish to assimilate to Western culture, but wishes to escape it.

  8. Likes Levanda liked this post
  9. #5
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Location
    Nashville, Tennessee
    Posts
    13,234
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Levanda View Post
    IMy excuses for to be so critical, I just wish to understand more about music. Would somebody open my mind.
    I appreciate your openness. Many people would throw up their hands and walk away.

    I remember the first time I heard Anton Webern's music, I actually got mad. It sounded so random, how could I tell if they were playing the right notes or just making it up? Some nice people helped me out, and now he's one of my favorite composers.

    I hope a new world is about to open to you.

  10. Likes PetrB, hpowders, Levanda and 2 others liked this post
  11. #6
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    philadelphia,pennsylvania
    Posts
    822
    Post Thanks / Like
    Blog Entries
    6

    Default

    There are plenty of strange music like hip-hop/rap heavy metal.That techno music sounds unnatural to me.
    Last edited by mtmailey; Oct-14-2014 at 19:26.

  12. Likes MoonlightSonata, Levanda, Figleaf and 2 others liked this post
  13. #7
    Senior Member MoonlightSonata's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2014
    Location
    New Zealand
    Posts
    3,393
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Levanda View Post
    I was listened John Cage Music of Changes 1951. I did not gave my satisfaction, for my listening skills it was no melody and nothing intellectual and strange to my understandings. I thought I can do like that just press piano keys and something will come out. My excuses for to be so critical, I just wish to understand more about music. Would somebody open my mind. Many thanks.
    Quote Originally Posted by Manxfeeder View Post
    I appreciate your openness. Many people would throw up their hands and walk away.

    I remember the first time I heard Anton Webern's music, I actually got mad. It sounded so random, how could I tell if they were playing the right notes or just making it up? Some nice people helped me out, and now he's one of my favorite composers.

    I hope a new world is about to open to you.
    Yes, I was like that with Stravinsky. It's wonderful when the music suddenly seems to make sense.
    ≥12

  14. Likes Manxfeeder, Levanda liked this post
  15. #8
    Senior Member Bulldog's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2013
    Location
    Albuquerque, New Mexico
    Posts
    22,825
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by millionrainbows View Post
    John Cage is a native-born American, so he understands the oriental approach, and thus has no wish to assimilate to Western culture, but wishes to escape it.
    What do you mean by "native-born American"?

  16. #9
    Senior Member Levanda's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2014
    Posts
    116
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Many thanks for good explanation, I think I try to listening again some strange music in short time, just to try again but I do not wish to put myself pressure to like it and yes absolutely agree different music is better for all us.

  17. Likes Itullian, Manxfeeder, hpowders and 1 others liked this post
  18. #10
    Senior Member Woodduck's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2014
    Location
    Ashland, OR
    Posts
    15,100
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Anything can be interesting, in some way or other, if you want to take an interest.

    This should be an excellent test of that thesis.

  19. Likes Marschallin Blair, Levanda, hpowders and 1 others liked this post
  20. #11
    Senior Member Marschallin Blair's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Location
    Southern California
    Posts
    9,367
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Woodduck View Post
    Anything can be interesting, in some way or other, if you want to take an interest.

    This should be an excellent test of that thesis.
    Duck, I didn't see you there. . . . . . . . We're you saying something?
    "Let me have my own way in exactly everything, and a sunnier and more pleasant creature does not exist." - Thomas Carlyle

  21. #12
    Senior Member PetrB's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2012
    Posts
    11,622
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Bulldog View Post
    What do you mean by "native-born American"?
    Not to claim to speak for hisself, but lets just assume, kinda safely, that:
    the dude means, like, "not Schoenberg, not European."

    ... and having not come from this culture, either.
    American Indian ~ Douglas Spotted Eagle and tribe members, "Arrival."
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X6kOxHoWPa0
    Last edited by PetrB; Oct-15-2014 at 05:58.

  22. Likes Levanda liked this post
  23. #13
    Junior Member kirsten's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2014
    Location
    United States
    Posts
    15
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by MoonlightSonata View Post
    Yes, I was like that with Stravinsky. It's wonderful when the music suddenly seems to make sense.
    Exactly the same with me. When I first listened to the Rite of Spring I hated it. But as I listened to it more it grew on me and I was able to appreciate how the music conveyed so much emotion. Now it is one of my favorite pieces of music. Just keep an open mind and try new things. Who knows, you just might discover some great music.

  24. Likes ptr, MoonlightSonata liked this post
  25. #14
    Senior Member MoonlightSonata's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2014
    Location
    New Zealand
    Posts
    3,393
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by kirsten View Post
    Exactly the same with me. When I first listened to the Rite of Spring I hated it. But as I listened to it more it grew on me and I was able to appreciate how the music conveyed so much emotion. Now it is one of my favorite pieces of music. Just keep an open mind and try new things. Who knows, you just might discover some great music.
    What a perfect description!
    ≥12

  26. #15
    Senior Member millionrainbows's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2012
    Location
    USA
    Posts
    13,624
    Post Thanks / Like
    Blog Entries
    137

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Levanda View Post
    I was listened John Cage Music of Changes 1951.
    You was? I was, too.

    Quote Originally Posted by Levanda View Post
    I did not gave my satisfaction...
    Why did you not gave? I gave satisfaction, and the person next to me thanked me for it.

    Quote Originally Posted by Levanda View Post
    ...for my listening skills it was no melody...
    That observation presupposes that music should be melodic. You should be listening for isolated "events" in this music.

    Quote Originally Posted by Levanda View Post
    ...and nothing intellectual......and strange to my understandings.
    I think what you mean is that the music doesn't seem to posture intellectually. It simply "is." You are on the right track here.

    Quote Originally Posted by Levanda View Post
    ...I thought I can do like that just press piano keys and something will come out.
    Oh, that's a variant on "My four-year-old kid could do that!" or "That sounds like a cat walking on the piano!" Apparently, this critical syndrome is not confined to the continent U.S., but is, indeed worldwide.

    Quote Originally Posted by Levanda View Post
    My excuses for to be so critical, I just wish to understand more about music. Would somebody open my mind. Many thanks.
    Is that a question, or a complaint?

  27. Likes ptr, MoonlightSonata, Levanda liked this post

Similar Threads

  1. Strange But True Classical Music Facts...
    By Icarus in forum Classical Music Discussion
    Replies: 119
    Last Post: Jun-14-2017, 05:00
  2. Ever had any strange classical music dreams?
    By clavichorder in forum Classical Music Discussion
    Replies: 58
    Last Post: Nov-25-2015, 18:45
  3. Strange experience with classical music
    By deeppurpled in forum Classical Music Discussion
    Replies: 1
    Last Post: Oct-16-2010, 17:01

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •