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Historical Wagner Recordings...............

800K views 5K replies 147 participants last post by  Seattleoperafan 
#1 ·
I have many Wagner recordings, but am a bit light on the great mono historical recordings.

Which are the ones I need to get? Your favorites?

thanks
 
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#394 ·
Are you aware that Kaufmann has recorded the Wesendonck Lieder. Very different with a male voice but very good, nonetheless.
 
#395 · (Edited)
Have you heard the Kinder Katechismus by Wagner. He composed it for Cosima's birthday and a boy soprano choir performed it at the foot of the stairs of their house the morning of her birthday. It is famous for using the redemption motif from the Immolation scene in Götterdämmerung as a theme at the end of the piece. It was recorded by Solti and the VPO and members of the Vienna Boys Choir at the time he recorded Götterdämmerung and can be found on a highlights disc available on Decca Eloquence with some overtures and preludes conducted by Solti, Mehta and Edo de Waart. It was also available on vinyl as part of the three disc talk by Deryck Cooke that was part of the original 22 disc presentation case in 1965. It was coupled with the Siegfried Idyll.
 
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#396 ·
If you want the Wesendonck Lieder, there's a recording with Eileen Farrell and Leonard Bernstein which, back in the LP days, was coupled with a fabulous Immolation Scene. It was one of my first Wagner records, and I have to say I've heard a lot of recordings of the songs since then but none better. Just listen to the beauty and expressiveness of this:



The rest are on YT as well. What a pity that Farrell never sang Isolde.

Other singers who have made splendid recordings of the songs are Flagstad, Ludwig, Baker and Norman. They all have the sort of "between soprano and mezzo" voices that Wagner seemed to write his greatest music for.
 
#397 · (Edited)
If you want the Wesendonck Lieder, there's a recording with Eileen Farrell and Leonard Bernstein which, back in the LP days, was coupled with a fabulous Immolation Scene. It was one of my first Wagner records, and I have to say I've heard a lot of recordings of the songs since then but none better. Just listen to the beauty and expressiveness of this:



The rest are on YT as well. What a pity that Farrell never sang Isolde.

Other singers who have made splendid recordings of the songs are Flagstad, Ludwig, Baker and Norman. They all have the sort of "between soprano and mezzo" voices that Wagner seemed to write his greatest music for.
Are you aware that Kaufmann has recorded the Wesendonck Lieder. Very different with a male voice but very good, nonetheless.
They all sound a bit different depending on who sings them, definitely can hear the shimmering music cords later used in Tristan opera.........

Barbe mentions male vocalist version (kaufmann) similar to Mahler's "das lied von erde" where there are two male or male female duo versions available, I always prefer the female versions myself

Not finished yet a couple more purchases on the way, Orfeo label this time......





I had to get the 1959 Matacic Lohengrin after hearing it in this fine "wagners vision" boxset full of great complete 1950s Bayreuth operas as well as extend segments of many other famous versions.....price is very cheap and we have mentioned almost all the complete operas at one point in this thread....

 
#398 ·
^^^^^^Getting into the pricey area are we DA? :)
You used to get on Itullian about that :lol:

I have the Matacic, but not the Parsifal.
 
#407 ·
While in Tidal streaming I see they have the latest 1957 Kempe ROH Ring on Walhall label, I gave Walkure a spin. I am cautious of 1950s Wagner done outside of Bayreuth since sound quality can be less than expected, but here we have very good sound although not quite as good as 1957-58 Knappy Bayreuth Walhall for instance......previous release on Testament label Amazon user had complained of sound but here no issues I can hear.

What got my attention was Walkure act 3 (Hotter and Nilsson) Hotter gives us a different emotional perspective than his 1952 Keilberth Ring for Myto (recently discussed here) in 1952 he was commanding and authoritative with empathy towards Brunhilde knowing she did what she thought her father really wanted.......in 1957 Kempe he is broken and sounds defeated, there is a sense of self pity, I was surprised to hear this and wondered does Hotter free lance this or do different directors each year emphasize different emotional perspectives, interesting......

 
#410 ·
While in Tidal streaming I see they have the latest 1957 Kempe ROH Ring on Walhall label, I gave Walkure a spin. I am cautious of 1950s Wagner done outside of Bayreuth since sound quality can be less than expected, but here we have very good sound although not quite as good as 1957-58 Knappy Bayreuth Walhall for instance......previous release on Testament label Amazon user had complained of sound but here no issues I can hear.

What got my attention was Walkure act 3 (Hotter and Nilsson) Hotter gives us a different emotional perspective than his 1952 Keilberth Ring for Myto (recently discussed here) in 1952 he was commanding and authoritative with empathy towards Brunhilde knowing she did what she thought her father really wanted.......in 1957 Kempe he is broken and sounds defeated, there is a sense of self pity, I was surprised to hear this and wondered does Hotter free lance this or do different directors each year emphasize different emotional perspectives, interesting......

Probably both... But my guess is that directors tended to give an awesomely intelligent artist like Hotter fairly free reign to present his own perspectives on the characters he played. No doubt his active imagination enjoyed rethinking his roles, trying different things, and responding to the production and colleagues who surrounded him at the moment. I don't know how he got on with Wieland Wagner, but the grandson was evidently an inspired director of singers (just like grandpa), and may have contributed to Hotter's conception of Wotan, as he did to Nilsson's Isolde and the portrayals of many other singers.
 
#415 ·
Any tracking on your Kubelik trifecta?
i'd like to hear your opinion when you get them. :)
 
#416 ·
The Kubelik Lohengrin already arrived and it is very good with stereo sound but it will not challenge my reference studio or live versions of Lohengrin (Jess Thomas with Kempe and Sawallisch)

The imports from UK Kubelik Parsifal and Meister probably another week or so, I had another recent order from zoverstock and it took just over 3 weeks.......
 
#417 · (Edited)


One of our favorite Wagner sopranos Leonie Rysanek gave over 300 performances at the MET from 1959-96 and on the night of her last performance thank god someone had the presence of mind to film the final curtain call from backstage, this is so exciting and almost beyond what words can express......



Amazing she is age 69 here and died only two years later, one of the great ones
 
#418 ·
^That was fantastic DA.
Thank you for that :tiphat:
 
#422 ·


Was browsing youtube and stumbled across this........ had to have it.
I purchased the Walhall Eternity with 24bit issue :)

 
#423 ·
Yep. That's a good one. Walhall are going to bankrupt us all. Schuchter not pre-eminent among Wagner conductors and as far as I can research this is his only recorded performance.
 
#431 · (Edited)
^Hmm, I'll have to re listen to mine.
I don't recall having a problem with him.
Though I'm not a big fan.
 
#433 ·
The 62 is my favorite too.
I do like the Solti as well.
 
#435 ·
Interesting to hear that James King still sounds stiff-necked in the Kubelik Parsifal. He was one of three reasons not to own the Boulez: zippy conducting, a wobbly shrieking Kundry (Gwyneth Jones), and King. Three strikes and you're out! Don't know what those Amazon reviewers are thinking (my review is virtually the only one of the Boulez that tells it like it is). Wagner's heldentenor roles are a perennial problem, and several otherwise fine Parsifal recordings are compromised by the tenor. Of post-Melchior Wagnerians, Thomas and Vickers are the most reliable for combined voice and interpretation, though Domingo also sounds quite good in the part.
 
#444 ·
Thanks. I just started the prelude. What horrendous sound! Possibly the worst I've heard in my entire life. If you've never heard the music before you'd have little idea of the orchestration. Subtleties disappear completely behind noise. I see the total running time is 3:41, which means either that some passages are played very fast (though the prelude is slow) or the opera isn't all here; maybe something was cut in performance or there are chunks of the recording missing (there is a little piece missing from the prelude). Hmmm, yes...after the prelude is over, tempos are very fast indeed, and there's another snippet missing from the recording.

I'm listening now to Friedrich Schorr's Amfortas. His magnificent voice, legato style, and intelligence cut right through the noise. Oh, to have a heldenbariton like him around now! Emanuel List's Gurnemanz sounds pretty solid, though unimaginative. Bodansky keeps his narrative moving. More chunks missing from the music! Perfect tempo for the procession to the temple, and the knights sound decent, though it's clearly the Met and not Bayreuth, but the other choruses are quite distant. Titurel, way off somewhere, sounds like a great singer (who was Norman Cordon? He should have been the Gurnemanz). Bodansky rushes Schorr here; he seems to be after maximum contrast between fast and slow music.

Well, so much for Act 1. I'll have to resume later. I looked up Norman Cordon, apparently another superb singer no one talks about: http://sdrc.lib.uiowa.edu/traveling-culture/chau1/pdf/cordon/1/brochure.pdf
 
#445 ·
DA
Do you have this Lohengrin?
It's very good and good sound.

 
#450 ·
Well, so much for the sabbatical. I have just ordered another Meistersinger. This one is the Knappertsbusch on Naxos Historical. Recorded in Vienna between 1950 and 1951 with the VPO. Apparently it took a year because of Paul Schoeffler's illness which meant postponing some of the sessions until he was well again. I didn't know of its existence until I saw a picture of the cd cover while looking at some other Kna images! Bankruptcy and/or divorce beckons!
 
#451 ·
Can someone kindly remind me what the cut-off date is for what we consider to be an historical recording. Is it 1960 or later, say 1965 or even 1970? Thank you. I'm too lazy to read through all the posts.
 
#455 ·
Mostly 60s and before, but it's not rigid.
Post whatever you'd like. :)
 
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#452 ·
Knappertsbusch Naxos Meistersinger has just arrived. Hopefully I'll get to listen to it reasonably soon.
 
#453 ·
Isn't it curious that there are no great recordings of Parsifal from the New York Met. Even in the Wagner at the Met box it is conspicuous by its absence. You would think that there must be something languishing in the vaults somewhere.
 
#454 ·
Not so fast! There's this from 1938, which Figleaf brought up a while back and I started commenting upon:

Artur Bodanzky's 1938 Parsifal can be downloaded here:

https://drive.google.com/file/d/0BwA...ew?usp=sharing

Amfortas - Friedrich Schorr
Titurel - Norman Cordon
Gurnemanz - Emanuel List
Parsifal - Lauritz Melchior
Klingsor - Arnold Gabor
Kundry - Kirsten Flagstad
Alto Stimme - Doris Doe

Here were my off-the-cuff responses while listening, plus additional remarks:

Thanks. I just started the prelude. What horrendous sound! Possibly the worst I've heard in my entire life. If you've never heard the music before you'd have little idea of the orchestration. Subtleties disappear completely behind noise. I see the total running time is 3:41, which means either that some passages are played very fast (though the prelude is slow) or the opera isn't all here; maybe something was cut in performance or there are chunks of the recording missing (there is a little piece missing from the prelude). Hmmm, yes...after the prelude is over, tempos are very fast indeed, and there's another snippet missing from the recording.

I'm listening now to Friedrich Schorr's Amfortas. His magnificent voice, legato style, and intelligence cut right through the noise. Oh, to have a heldenbariton like him around now! Emanuel List's Gurnemanz sounds pretty solid, though unimaginative. Bodansky keeps his narrative moving. More chunks missing from the music! Perfect tempo for the procession to the temple, and the knights sound decent, though it's clearly the Met and not Bayreuth, but the other choruses are quite distant. Titurel, way off somewhere, sounds like a great singer (who was Norman Cordon? He should have been the Gurnemanz). Bodanzky rushes Schorr here; he seems to be after maximum contrast between fast and slow music.

Act 2 brings a change of conductor: Erich Leinsdorf was apparently drafted to give Bodanzky a rest. He gives us the fastest prelude I've ever heard, faster than Wagner asks for ("with movement but not rushed"). He also zips through the lovely flower maidens' waltz at such a clip that the singers can't execute it clearly and fall behind; the result is a horrible mess. Otherwise the act goes very well, with a superbly gloating and nasty Klingsor (better than anyone on record except Hermann Uhde), Flagstad predictably a little cool but vocally impeccable, and Melchior simply wiping out the competition, catching every nuance of character and emotion in this critical scene.

Act 3 brings back List's Gurnemanz; I think the singer was past his prime, really, and I missed the nuance others have brought to the part. But Bodanzky conducts with power and the other singers acquit themselves well. As in act 2, Melchior makes the final scene a true climax of the drama, and the ending has a feeling of genuine catharsis as it should.

This is not a recording for those not well acquainted with the opera, owing to its poor sound quality. I don't know how the recording was made, but there are little bits of music missing here and there, as if someone was changing tapes by some inefficient means. Neverthelss it's a worthy historical document for some fine singing and conducting (I think Bodanzky was the Met's major Wagnerian in those days), and above all for the magnificently sung Parsifal of Lauritz Melchior. Fortunately, he also made commercial recordings at about this time of his act 2 scene with Flagstad and his final scene in act 3, so we can hear him in superior sound.
 
#458 ·
^Thanks for the great review DA. Glad you're enjoying it.

Because of price, I'll be sticking to 62 Knap, Kub and Solti for awhile.
Maybe add the 51 later. :)
Still have many other historicals on my list.
And I'm not a huge fan of the sound of Vickers voice. Although
I acknowledge he's a great singer.
 
#460 ·
DA,
Have you had a chance to listen to Kubelik's Meistersinger yet?
 
#461 · (Edited)
Reason for 2 conductors in 1938 Met Parsifal

According to the booklet accompanying the Myto CDs of the Met 1938 Parsifal, Bodanzky suffered a coronary attack during Act 1. Leinsdorf was in the house, and took over, conducting act 2. Bodanzky recovered sufficiently to conduct act 3. Regarding the frequent gaps: "the performance is preserved on acetates which were not recorded with the generally used 'overlap' system introduced in Europe. In this case the recording engineer switched over to the next acetate at the end of the first one- hence there is a gap of a few seconds every time a new acetate was started."
 
#462 ·
Whilst the English cricket season interrupts opera listening; I received in the post today a delivery from Pristine and pressed play a few minutes ago

Die Meistersinger Von Nürnberg
Ferdinand Frantz - Hans Sachs
Gottlob Frick - Veit Pogner
Elisabeth Grümmer - Eva
Gerhard Unger - Davis
Hermann Prey - Ein Nachtwächter

Choirs of the Municipal Opera and German State Opera, Berlin
(chorus master: Hermann Lüddecke)
Choir of St. Hedwin's Cathedral, Berlin
(chorus-master: Karl Forster)
Berlin Philharmonic Orchestra
Conducted by Rudolf Kempe
Studio recording from 1956

XR remastering by Andrew Rose at Pristine Audio, August-October 2010

Hair Head Musical instrument Poster Font


So far absolutely thrilling and beautiful sound. I have not heard any other release of this recording before but this is wonderful
 
#464 ·
XR remastering by Andrew Rose at Pristine Audio, August-October 2010

View attachment 70328

So far absolutely thrilling and beautiful sound. I have not heard any other release of this recording before but this is wonderful
Good pick up lad, that's the one we keep talking about.....even better than EMI release with Pristine XR!



Why stop now, go ahead and get the 1953 Krauss Ring in Pristine XR remaster with ambient stereo :devil:
 
#463 ·
^^^
Been wanting that one for a looooooooooooooooong time :)
 
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