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Thread: Your Bach Cello Suites recordings

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    Senior Member jegreenwood's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mandryka View Post
    This is the reason I stopped using Tidal years ago. It may have been me you "engaged with" Are you saying I'm a "ranter"? Is that a good thing?

    These are obviously divisive performances -- as always with great art -- I just got a message saying
    Absolutely not you. This guy engaged in ad hominem attacks against me.
    Last edited by jegreenwood; Dec-29-2019 at 17:26.

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    Quote Originally Posted by jegreenwood View Post
    Absolutely not you. This guy engaged in ad hominem attacks against me.
    Ah! That's not good.

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    Senior Member wkasimer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mandryka View Post
    Anyone formed a view on this one? I don't have the booklet, so I can't say anything much about the bowing technique she's exploring, other than that it's radically different from conservatory technique, it's supposed to be informed by historical practice, and is based in some way on gamba bowing.

    Info here

    https://www.jsbachcellosuites.com/project.html


    Attachment 128202

    I'm listening right now to the 5th, and I'm impressed by an urgency, an intensity, in the allemande.
    I have to confess that I don't much care for this, based on a listen via Spotify. It's mostly a matter of the sheer sound that she produces - I'm not sure if it's her instrument or her bowing method, but there's a rather nasal quality to the sound that's tough for me to tolerate for an entire suite. It also sounds to me as though she's playing a lot of open strings, which stick out. None of this is helped by the rather close recording.

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    Quote Originally Posted by wkasimer View Post
    I have to confess that I don't much care for this, based on a listen via Spotify. It's mostly a matter of the sheer sound that she produces - I'm not sure if it's her instrument or her bowing method, but there's a rather nasal quality to the sound that's tough for me to tolerate for an entire suite. It also sounds to me as though she's playing a lot of open strings, which stick out. None of this is helped by the rather close recording.
    Yes, I understand. It probably helps not to be much of a connoisseur of cello sound!

    Just watching that video that Vahe Sahakian posted makes me want to know if you've ever played one of these things. Have you ever hung a cello round your neck like that?

    https://www.bachvereniging.nl/en/bwv/bwv-1012/
    Last edited by Mandryka; Dec-30-2019 at 18:17.

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    Senior Member wkasimer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mandryka View Post

    Just watching that video that Vahe Sahakian posted makes me want to know if you've ever played one of these things. Have you ever hung a cello round your neck like that?

    https://www.bachvereniging.nl/en/bwv/bwv-1012/
    No, I haven't tried one of these - a "shoulder cello" or violoncello da spalla. I suspect that anyone used to playing a "normal" cello would have a brutal time trying to learn to play one of these - everything is backwards. It'd probably be easier for a violinist or violist.

    There's a nice recording of the six suites on such an instrument, played by Dmitry Badiarov, who is also a luthier:

    badiarov.jpg

    http://violoncellodaspalla.blogspot.com/

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    Quote Originally Posted by wkasimer View Post
    No, I haven't tried one of these - a "shoulder cello" or violoncello da spalla. I suspect that anyone used to playing a "normal" cello would have a brutal time trying to learn to play one of these - everything is backwards. It'd probably be easier for a violinist or violist.

    There's a nice recording of the six suites on such an instrument, played by Dmitry Badiarov, who is also a luthier:

    badiarov.jpg

    http://violoncellodaspalla.blogspot.com/
    Yes I know it well and it's my favourite of the shoulder cello recordings I've heard

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    Isn't that Badiarov in Vahe Sahakian's video clip? I thought it was. If so, I agree, he's excellent.

    There is a heroic, noble quality to Janos Starker's cello playing on his earlier Mercury Living Presence recording that I don't hear in other versions (or at least not to the same degree of expressiveness). Among older LP versions, I used to like Pierre Fournier and Maurice Gendron, too.

    Otherwise, I've most liked Anner Bylsma's pioneering 1979 period recording on Seon (or Sony), Jean-Guihen Queyras, Ophelie Gaillard's 2nd recording (as I've not heard her first), and Pieter Wispelway's 1st recording--which I may be alone here in preferring to his 2nd recording. (I've not heard Wispelway's 3rd recording.)

    Among those that have caught my interest, I'd most like to hear Christophe Coin and Arnau Tomàs play these suites, as both cellists have impressed me in other music; as well as perhaps Roel Dieltiens, István Várdi, and Zuill Bailey ...

    Christophe Coin in the Cello Suites nos. 2, 3, & 5:
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iWEEntxiqb4
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b7xjor1hVUo
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R_iOxkfnRoc
    Last edited by Josquin13; Dec-31-2019 at 10:48.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Josquin13 View Post
    Isn't that Badiarov in Vahe Sahakian's video clip? I thought it was. If so, I agree, he's excellent.
    It's Sergey Malov. He is a bit more dynamic and energetic than Badiarov.

    He recorded the suite here:

    http://www.easonus.com/catalog/13-strings-vol.1

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    Quote Originally Posted by premont View Post
    It's Sergey Malov. He is a bit more dynamic and energetic than Badiarov.

    He recorded the suite here:

    http://www.easonus.com/catalog/13-strings-vol.1
    In fact I didn’t enjoy it very much.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mandryka View Post
    In fact I didn’t enjoy it very much.
    I think the prelude, the courante, the gavotte and the gigue (suite 6) in his hands have much of that dancing, exuberant quality I associate with these movements. But I prefer Badiarov to Malov in the suites 1 and 2.

    BTW have you heard Malov's recording of Bartok's solo violin sonata (filler to the CD with Bach suites 1 and 6)? I had never heard the sonata before (!!) and don't know what to think of it.

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    No I haven’t heard Malov playing the Bartok solo sonata, in fact I didn’t know that he’d made a recording! I’ve come to appreciate the music very much though, mostly through Leila Josefowicz’s CD.

    Oh, happy new year
    Last edited by Mandryka; Jan-01-2020 at 11:02.

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    Absolutely perfect, great remaster, sounds like it was recorded today. Ma understands the music and shows great taste, no clumsiness or awkwardness, no vanity, decadence, or narcissism; every passage makes sense standing alone and together with the next; fantastic emotional understanding.



    More dramatic, squeezes everything out the pieces. The recording quality isn't as crisp as the former but Rostropovich makes up for it.
    Last edited by 1996D; Jan-03-2020 at 13:17.

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    Senior Member wkasimer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 1996D View Post


    Absolutely perfect, great remaster, sounds like it was recorded today. Ma understands the music and shows great taste, no clumsiness or awkwardness, no vanity, decadence, or narcissism; every passage makes sense standing alone and together with the next; fantastic emotional understanding.
    I gave this a rehearing a couple of days ago. It's the kind of version that I might recommend to someone who's never heard the music before and is looking for a single recording. It is beautifully and immaculately played, and very well recorded - but I hear very little beyond that. Ma never makes an ugly or unmusical sound, and that may be part of the problem - he doesn't have the wide interpretive palette of someone like Wispelwey or Queyras, or a very clear interpretive stance, like Heinrich Schiff. Ma turns Bach into something akin to background music. His most recent set is vastly superior interepretively, if not quite as technically fluent (after all, Ma is now well past 60).



    More dramatic, squeezes everything out the pieces. The recording quality isn't as crisp as the former but Rostropovich makes up for it.
    I like this one even less. By the time Rostropovich got around to recording these, he was past his best technically after a very long and busy career. I don't particularly care for the sound that he produces and his playing is heavy-handed, as though playing forte gives the music gravitas. If you want a big, full-bodied cello sound, try Truls Mork's set instead.

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    Senior Member Merl's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by wkasimer View Post
    I gave this a rehearing a couple of days ago. It's the kind of version that I might recommend to someone who's never heard the music before and is looking for a single recording. It is beautifully and immaculately played, and very well recorded - but I hear very little beyond that. Ma never makes an ugly or unmusical sound, and that may be part of the problem - he doesn't have the wide interpretive palette of someone like Wispelwey or Queyras, or a very clear interpretive stance, like Heinrich Schiff. Ma turns Bach into something akin to background music. His most recent set is vastly superior interepretively, if not quite as technically fluent (after all, Ma is now well past 60).



    I like this one even less. By the time Rostropovich got around to recording these, he was past his best technically after a very long and busy career. I don't particularly care for the sound that he produces and his playing is heavy-handed, as though playing forte gives the music gravitas. If you want a big, full-bodied cello sound, try Truls Mork's set instead.
    Totally echo those sentiments. Ma's latest set is leagues better than that 1st recording. As for Rostropovich I've never liked that set at all and find the recording particularly off-putting. Give me Queyras, Haimovitz et al any day.
    Last edited by Merl; Jan-03-2020 at 14:49.

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