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Thread: Arnold Schoenberg (1874 – 1951)

  1. #931
    Senior Member CnC Bartok's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by starthrower View Post
    I have Zemlinsky's non symphonic orchestral works on a nice EMI 3-fer set conducted by James Conlon. Good stuff! Later I bought his Symphony CD but didn't like it as much.
    I have to be honest and say I have struggled to get much out of Zemlinsky so far, and have not really persevered either. Mein Schlecht, alas. I felt conned when I was told the Lyric Symphony was "another Lied von der Erde", and it frankly isn't.

    I have enjoyed some composers who might be considered similar to AZ, like Diepenbrock, Schmidt and Schreker, perhaps I ought to have another go, and I have several discs from James Conlon, rate him pretty highly, so he may be a good way in? Any pieces other than the Lyric you'd say you've particularly liked, the two other Symphonies aside?
    Last edited by CnC Bartok; Nov-08-2019 at 19:41.

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    Senior Member Baron Scarpia's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by starthrower View Post
    I have Zemlinsky's non symphonic orchestral works on a nice EMI 3-fer set conducted by James Conlon. Good stuff! Later I bought his Symphony CD but didn't like it as much.
    I find the Conlon recordings of Zemlinsky Orchestral music to be marred by very unengaging audio engineering, which seems to diffuse all of the drama in the music. I seem to recall the Conlon recording of the Sinfonietta falling flat, while the Dausgaard recording on Chandos being a revelation. Chailly recordings are also recommended, as are Zemlinsky string quartets.
    There are two kinds of music, good music and the other kind. - Duke Ellington.

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  4. #933
    Senior Member starthrower's Avatar
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    The Lyric Symphony wasn't one of the pieces I really liked. I liked the first disc in that set starting with the Mermaid. I know it's available separately on a single EMI disc.

    For my money another Viennese composer Ernst Krenek is more modern and interesting that Zemlinsky. JPC has a number of his discs on sale. The chamber orchestra disc on the Toccata label is great, and they are selling it cheap. His string quartets on Capriccio by the Petersen Quartet are also highly recommended.
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  6. #934
    Senior Member Baron Scarpia's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by starthrower View Post
    The Lyric Symphony wasn't one of the pieces I really liked. I liked the first disc in that set starting with the Mermaid. I know it's available separately on a single EMI disc.

    For my money another Viennese composer Ernst Krenek is more modern and interesting that Zemlinsky. JPC has a number of his discs on sale. The chamber orchestra disc on the Toccata label is great, and they are selling it cheap. His string quartets on Capriccio by the Petersen Quartet are also highly recommended.
    I vaguely recall enjoying Krenek (at first I was confusing him with Toch, who I like less). Anyway, if you haven't listened, I think the Sinfonietta is one of Zemlinsky's best pieces.
    There are two kinds of music, good music and the other kind. - Duke Ellington.

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    Senior Member starthrower's Avatar
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    I pretty much enjoy most of the Second Viennese School composers. I have symphonies, piano music, and quartets by Egon Wellesz as well.
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  9. #936
    Senior Member Baron Scarpia's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by starthrower View Post
    I pretty much enjoy most of the Second Viennese School composers. I have symphonies, piano music, and quartets by Egon Wellesz as well.
    Wellesz is a favorite of mine as well. If you like Wellesz you will probably like Frankel symphonies. Also Henk Badings (cpo series, probably in limbo).
    Last edited by Baron Scarpia; Nov-09-2019 at 00:02.
    There are two kinds of music, good music and the other kind. - Duke Ellington.

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    Senior Member starthrower's Avatar
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    Somebody mention Ernst Toch, and I like him too. I have the symphonies on CPO. And I discovered another CPO disc with an interesting vocal work, Die Chinesische Flöte. I've been waiting for CPO to box his out of print string quartet CDs.
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    Senior Member flamencosketches's Avatar
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    @Star, the Sinopoli set is good. Very lush, yet detail-oriented performances. The Gurrelieder is amazing but I haven't heard the whole thing. And I really enjoy the Webern disc. His might be the definitive Im Sommerwind and the later, more "Webernian" pieces are great too. I really like his recording of the Symphony op.21 and the Variations op.30. I haven't listened to much of the Berg yet.

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    Quote Originally Posted by flamencosketches View Post
    @Star, the Sinopoli set is good. Very lush, yet detail-oriented performances. The Gurrelieder is amazing but I haven't heard the whole thing. And I really enjoy the Webern disc. His might be the definitive Im Sommerwind and the later, more "Webernian" pieces are great too. I really like his recording of the Symphony op.21 and the Variations op.30. I haven't listened to much of the Berg yet.
    I've got Sinopoli's Webern as a single disc, and I agree; it's one of my most valued recordings of Webern.





    Seeing as the 8-CD box is only $14.95, I'll have to get it.






    Last edited by millionrainbows; Nov-10-2019 at 14:54.

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    Senior Member flamencosketches's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by millionrainbows View Post
    I've got Sinopoli's Webern as a single disc, and I agree; it's one of my most valued recordings of Webern.





    Seeing as the 8-CD box is only $14.95, I'll have to get it.






    I couldn’t pass it up at the price.

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    Senior Member starthrower's Avatar
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    I think I mentioned this several pages back, but Chailly's Gurrelieder is one of the most vivid recordings I've encountered. It's on YouTube if anyone wants to give it a listen.
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    Senior Member philoctetes's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CnC Bartok View Post
    I felt conned when I was told the Lyric Symphony was "another Lied von der Erde", and it frankly isn't.
    I consider this a good thing. Mahler did not own "orientalism" and Das Lied is not IMO the last word on that phase or vocal symphonies either. Once past the expectations it stands as a good piece of music in it's own way. The earlier Zemlinsky, the numbered symphonies and the Mermaid, are not so distinguished.

    Zemlinsky became unique in his late phase - the LS, the Chalk Circle, string quartets 3 and 4,various lieder - but not good enough to win a large audience. I compare him to Strauss or Berg, more favorably than Mahler. More exposure in the last 20 years has been good for his rep, but recordings like Conlon's could be improved upon.
    Last edited by philoctetes; Nov-10-2019 at 17:52.

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    Senior Member Blancrocher's Avatar
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    I heard and enjoyed the Quatuor Diotima's 2nd-Viennese cycle on Spotify, being particularly interested in the Schoenberg performances. If it weren't so pricey at the moment, I'd probably buy it as an alternative to my old LaSalle disks, which don't get many plays these days.

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    I'm listening to the Gielen box, Edition 8, which arrived yesterday. Now, it's Pelleas und Mellisande (1902-1903). The sound is very good, the orchestra is very good, and Gielen obviously is devoted to this music.

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    Senior Member starthrower's Avatar
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    I received my copy as well. I haven't listened to any of it yet but I was perusing the booklet last night and it's full of Gielen's commentary which I will read more completely in the days to come.

    Update: I'm listening to the first Pelleas recorded in 1973. Wow! This sounds superb! I appreciate the fact that they printed all of the track and recording info on each CD sleeve so flipping through the booklet isn't necessary.
    Last edited by starthrower; Nov-13-2019 at 18:25.
    Short-term thinkers are rewarded with reelection, while those who dare to take seriously our responsibility to future generations commonly find themselves out of office.

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