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Thread: For love of the Baroque...

  1. #1006
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    Quote Originally Posted by philoctetes View Post
    You got me wanting to hear viols, found a new group (to me). A good one too.

    Be sure to check their recording of music by William Cranford too.

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    Senior Member Ingélou's Avatar
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    Time to move on from Albinoni.

    My listening has been very sporadic over the last few weeks because of things happening in my outer and inner life.

    Verdict?

    I am glad I listened to him.
    He is -
    Gorgeous - graceful - elegant - often spirited - at times lyrical & tender.

    I liked him, think he's a good composer, and would listen to him any chance I got.

    But he wouldn't go in my pick-list of Baroque Composers - because he is a little smooth & neat for my taste.
    He is Strawberry Creme music - when my taste is for something with more bite. (Hazelnut Cluster? )

    My notes on the different pieces are very samey - 'gracious - elegant - lyrical' etc - so I'll mostly just list what I listened to.

    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
    My Albinoni Samples on the Net:

    Tomaso Albinoni Chamber Sonatas - Donatella Colombo, Clare Ibbott & Marco Rossi
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UMmirtZ_m6o

    Carlo Torriani sings: PIMPINONE (complete opera) by Tomaso Albinoni
    (Actually, I got a bit bored with this - didn't like the male voice much.)
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gIHvYSh55sU

    Tommaso Albinoni: Oboe Concerto in D minor, Op. 9, No. 2 (Han de Vries/Alma Musica Amsterdam)
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jfExK5Okrkg
    As one of the comments below the video says (in French) - A marvel, which refreshes the heart - I don't get tired of it.
    Last edited by Ingélou; May-14-2019 at 09:49.
    ~ Mollie ~
    My fiddle my joy.

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    Senior Member Ingélou's Avatar
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    Albinoni - Post 2.
    I also listened to these cds found for me by Mollie John.
    Thank you - they were gorgeous, spirited, elegant, etc, and I loved the music.

    Quote Originally Posted by Mollie John View Post
    Attachment 116042

    These superb supremely tuneful compositions - rhythmic agility coupled with melodic vibrancy - played on period instruments by the Academy of Ancient Music conducted by Christopher Hogwood are well worth a listen and may hopefully change a mind or two or three! in regards to the merits of Albinoni -

    Link to complete album - (36 tracks) -

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5gKT...Hg8svg&index=1

    An additional recording of merit -

    Attachment 116043

    Link to complete album -

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5zO-w3BGDkI
    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

    Vivaldi next, and we're going away from time to time & have a lot to do over the next few weeks.
    Vivaldi - five of the best.
    I've got the Vivaldi thread I posted chock-full of fab suggestions, so I think it's a while before I'll report back.
    Last edited by Ingélou; May-14-2019 at 09:52.
    ~ Mollie ~
    My fiddle my joy.

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  7. #1009
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    What do you think of this, Ingelou? I mention you because you play violin



    Edward Bast too may appreciate it I think.
    Last edited by Mandryka; May-16-2019 at 21:27.

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    Senior Member Gallus's Avatar
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    Today (or, well, yesterday, it just passed midnight) is the birthday of Johann Jakob Froberger, to me a unique figure in the history of keyboard writing and one of my favourite composers for the keyboard in any era. He has such a distinctive style, deep and as dark as any music past or present.



    Here's a very sensitive performance a friend linked me, which I found to be a revelation. Very appropriate for a Londoner in a melancholic state at the moment.
    Last edited by Gallus; May-20-2019 at 00:21.

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  11. #1011
    Senior Member Ingélou's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mandryka View Post
    What do you think of this, Ingelou? I mention you because you play violin



    Edward Bast too may appreciate it I think.
    I don't like it, sorry. The tone of the violin seems very whingy to me.

    Luckily, since I mostly play folk-fiddle, I don't think I can be fairly accused of sounding like this.
    Last edited by Ingélou; May-23-2019 at 19:44.
    ~ Mollie ~
    My fiddle my joy.

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    Senior Member Ingélou's Avatar
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    We listened to this cd (Division Music by Pellingman's Saraband) on our way home from Yorkshire today, and it's so beautiful - I love this music and this sound.

    Last edited by Ingélou; May-23-2019 at 20:18.
    ~ Mollie ~
    My fiddle my joy.

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    Senior Member hammeredklavier's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mandryka View Post
    What do you think of this, Ingelou? I mention you because you play violin



    Edward Bast too may appreciate it I think.
    this was composed in 1781, I'm not sure if it fits the definition of a "baroque work" in the context of the thread

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    Quote Originally Posted by hammeredklavier View Post
    this was composed in 1781, I'm not sure if it fits the definition of a "baroque work" in the context of the thread
    Well, that's an interesting thought. Care to expand?

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    Senior Member hammeredklavier's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mandryka View Post
    Well, that's an interesting thought. Care to expand?
    I mean, this thread isn't for stuff that we normally classify as 'neo-baroque' music. Is it? Is it ok to post stuff like Mozart Miserere in A minor K85 (1770), or Kyrie in D minor K90 (1772), Fugue in G minor K401 (1773), 'baroque-style' music that was not composed in the baroque era?
    Last edited by hammeredklavier; May-24-2019 at 01:28.

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    Senior Member flamencosketches's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by hammeredklavier View Post
    I mean, this thread isn't for stuff that we normally classify as 'neo-baroque' music. Is it? Is it ok to post stuff like Mozart Miserere in A minor K85 (1770), or Kyrie in D minor K90 (1772), Fugue in G minor K401 (1773), 'baroque-style' music that was not composed in the baroque era?
    I say yes. As long as it has all of the hallmarks of a genre, it doesn't matter all that much when it was composed. For example, there were composers writing Romantic music well into the mid 20th century and even to this day. That doesn't make their music not Romantic.

    However, this mostly applies to music written not too long after the consensus end of the period. For example, so-called Neo-Baroque music written in the 21st century is probably not worth sharing in this thread due to necessary deviations from the Baroque mold shaped by the passage of two or three centuries. In any case, it's not likely to be as good as the original stuff.

    Just about anything within the 18th century is fair game, I say. But this is one man's opinion, what do I know!

  20. #1017
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    Quote Originally Posted by hammeredklavier View Post
    I mean, this thread isn't for stuff that we normally classify as 'neo-baroque' music. Is it? Is it ok to post stuff like Mozart Miserere in A minor K85 (1770), or Kyrie in D minor K90 (1772), Fugue in G minor K401 (1773), 'baroque-style' music that was not composed in the baroque era?
    Ah I see, I’ve noticed this before, they see baroque as referring to a time period, and a pretty well defined one. I always thought it was a style. Why, how and by whom is the baroque time period defined?

  21. #1018
    Senior Member hammeredklavier's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by flamencosketches View Post
    Just about anything within the 18th century is fair game, I say. But this is one man's opinion, what do I know!
    Quote Originally Posted by Mandryka View Post
    Ah I see, I’ve noticed this before, they see baroque as referring to a time period, and a pretty well defined one. I always thought it was a style. Why, how and by whom is the baroque time period defined?
    Very well, in that case,



    ]

    Michael Haydn - P 43, MH 287 - Symphony No. 22 in D major, III. Presto ma non troppo:
    https://youtu.be/qIPffGnkaKU?t=734
    Last edited by hammeredklavier; May-24-2019 at 13:10.

  22. #1019
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    Quote Originally Posted by hammeredklavier View Post
    Very well, in that case,
    Well noone was saying that anything c18 is baroque.

    I repeat. Is "baroque" a style and how is that style defined? Is baroque just a time period, and how and more importantly, why, was that defined?

    My own view is that an essential feature baroque is that the counterpoint is allowed to lead the music into dissonances, the essence of the music is that the contrapuntal logic is primary. For me, Rameau, Haendel, Corelli,Vivaldi, Boismortier, Mondonville, Balbastre for example, are at the limits, it's stretching a point to call their music baroque because the nobility of contrapuntal logic has given way to simplified harmonies and the art of decoration (in French they call their music classicisme in fact.) Their music is less profound, too preoccupied with surface charm, to be called baroque.

    Re CPE Bach some of what he did seems to me to be really grappling with this movement into surface charm; another interesting one to think about is Seixas.
    Last edited by Mandryka; May-24-2019 at 07:33.

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    Senior Member Ingélou's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mandryka View Post
    Ah I see, I’ve noticed this before, they see baroque as referring to a time period, and a pretty well defined one. I always thought it was a style. Why, how and by whom is the baroque time period defined?
    Difficult.

    This question has popped up on the thread before now.

    And once someone's started a thread, they can't control what happens on it.

    So this is just my opinion.

    Style is important, in my view - a lot of composers in the early 1600s sound much more like 'renaissance' than the new baroque style.

    But in the end, we could dispute definitions of baroque style endlessly, so I think it's best to have defining dates, arbitrary though that sounds.

    After all, there are threads for 'early music', 'galante', 'classical', or particular composers, so no need to put on here anything that isn't pretty obviously baroque.

    I started my thread with a project to listen to all the composers on the Wiki Baroque Short List, so I envisaged using the Wiki dates - 1600 to 1750 - as a guide.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Baroque_music

    I did (originally, not knowing much about the matter) consider the C. P. E. Bach video to be beyond the remit of this thread, but I answered Mandryka's question out of courtesy.
    The tone of the violin made more impression on me than the style of the music!
    Last edited by Ingélou; May-24-2019 at 09:20.
    ~ Mollie ~
    My fiddle my joy.

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