Results 1 to 12 of 12

Thread: What Beethoven tells me

  1. #1
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jun 2013
    Location
    Canberra, Australia
    Posts
    120
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default What Beethoven tells me

    Beethoven 9 has the following text:

    Wem der große Wurf gelungen,
    Eines Freundes Freund zu sein;
    Wer ein holdes Weib errungen,
    Mische seinen Jubel ein!
    Ja, wer auch nur eine Seele
    Sein nennt auf dem Erdenrund!
    Und wer's nie gekonnt, der stehle
    Weinend sich aus diesem Bund!

    For me, it sounds like:

    B: Do you have a friend?
    Me: No.
    B: A girlfriend?
    Me: No.
    B: Anyone on earth?
    Me: No.
    B: DIE!

    What do you think, please?

  2. Likes EddieRUKiddingVarese, Klassik, Kieran liked this post
  3. #2
    Senior Member Rogerx's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2018
    Location
    Europe
    Posts
    463
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    You need help perhaps, professional I mean, and I am not kidding.

  4. #3
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jun 2013
    Location
    Canberra, Australia
    Posts
    120
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Thank you, Rogerx. OK, if I see a shrink, and he suggests I kill myself, what would you think of that, please?
    Last edited by wzg; May-14-2018 at 04:57.

  5. Likes Klassik liked this post
  6. #4
    Senior Member EddieRUKiddingVarese's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Location
    Father of Electronic muse
    Posts
    4,591
    Post Thanks / Like
    Blog Entries
    17

    Default

    He has a shrunken head........
    "Everyone is born with genius, but most people only keep it a few minutes"
    ÉddïéRÛKíddîngVãrèsë! -I got a dog and not sure what to call it DoggydogdogMcDogface maybe............

  7. Likes wzg liked this post
  8. #5
    Senior Member Rogerx's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2018
    Location
    Europe
    Posts
    463
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by wzg View Post
    Thank you, Rogerx. OK, if I see a shrink, and he suggests I kill myself, what would you think of that, please?
    No professional will tell you that, you are in the wrong place, this is a music site not psychiatric help.

  9. #6
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jun 2013
    Location
    Canberra, Australia
    Posts
    120
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    OK. I mean: What do you think this text means? Do you think there's some shortcoming? Thank you.

  10. Likes EddieRUKiddingVarese liked this post
  11. #7
    Senior Member Fritz Kobus's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    Next to Detroit, Michigan
    Posts
    9,632
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by wzg View Post
    Beethoven 9 has the following text:

    Wem der große Wurf gelungen,
    Eines Freundes Freund zu sein;
    Wer ein holdes Weib errungen,
    Mische seinen Jubel ein!
    Ja, wer auch nur eine Seele
    Sein nennt auf dem Erdenrund!
    Und wer's nie gekonnt, der stehle
    Weinend sich aus diesem Bund!

    For me, it sounds like:

    B: Do you have a friend?
    Me: No.
    B: A girlfriend?
    Me: No.
    B: Anyone on earth?
    Me: No.
    B: DIE!

    What do you think, please?
    You need to consult someone who can properly translate the text.
    "My brothers, there's not a sinner in the world to whom the way of redemption is closed!"
    --Minne in Puccini's La Fanciulla del West.

  12. Likes EddieRUKiddingVarese liked this post
  13. #8
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2015
    Posts
    1,197
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    If you choose to be expansively cynical, you could interpret it that way -- but blame Schiller, not Beethoven.

  14. Likes Kieran, EddieRUKiddingVarese liked this post
  15. #9
    Senior Member Larkenfield's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2017
    Location
    Sedona
    Posts
    1,088
    Post Thanks / Like
    Blog Entries
    2

    Default

    “For me, it sounds like:

    B: Do you have a friend?
    Me: No.
    B: A girlfriend?
    Me: No.
    B: Anyone on earth?
    Me: No.
    B: DIE!”

    A worse distortion and translation is not possible. Schiller does not put everything in the negative. How could he when the thrust of the entire poem is about celebrating the Brotherhood of Man?

    Schiller’s Ode to Joy in German and English translation:
    https://en.m.wikisource.org/wiki/Translation:Ode_to_Joy
    Last edited by Larkenfield; May-14-2018 at 13:30.
    Great things are done by a series of small things brought together...Vincent Van Gogh

  16. Likes Kieran, EddieRUKiddingVarese liked this post
  17. #10
    Senior Member Nereffid's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Location
    Co. Dublin, Ireland
    Posts
    5,539
    Post Thanks / Like
    Blog Entries
    7

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by wzg View Post
    B: DIE!
    That's German for THE!
    See the results of my polls: most-liked composers and most-liked works.

  18. Likes Kieran, Art Rock, Razumovskymas and 1 others liked this post
  19. #11
    Senior Member Kieran's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Location
    Dublin, Ireland
    Posts
    2,755
    Post Thanks / Like
    Blog Entries
    1

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by wzg View Post
    OK. I mean: What do you think this text means? Do you think there's some shortcoming? Thank you.
    I think it's very simple, really. When I hear it, I translate it thusly:

    "Oh la la la la la la la, dum de dum de dum de dum!
    La la la la la la icecream, peanut butter, hear I come!
    La la ice cream, blah blah phish food,
    Ben and Gerry's la de dum,
    Chocolate, chewy caramel, cookie dough,
    Do-re-mi-fa-so-de dum!""

    And so on. Recently they added new flavours, but it translates easy into them as well...
    The Brain - is wider than the Sky

  20. Likes EddieRUKiddingVarese liked this post
  21. #12
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2016
    Posts
    662
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    It's just a wrong interpretation, and a rather sad one, perhaps reflecting the sad times we live in, but it's not the message of Schiller or Beethoven. A better interpretation:

    B: Have you made friends with that person trying to be your friend?
    Me: No.
    B: Have you won a girlfriend?
    Me: No.
    B: Then you will, obviously, slink away and cry. But there is a solution!
    Me: What's that?
    B: Make friends with that person trying to be your friend! Is that so hard?

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •