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Thread: RIP Quorthon

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    Default RIP Quorthon

    Five years ago today, we lost Quorthon who was the mastermind behind Bathory. If there's ever a musical hero, he was it!

    He also explicitly states the classical influence, as you can see in that article.
    the Dark Legions Archive underground metal reviews

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    RIP,Quorthorn was the best

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    I began to listen to classical music shortly after forming BATHORY, and from 1985-1986 it was all I would listen to. I had been playing various types of rock in various constellations since 1975, so picking up Wagner, Beethoven, Haydn and others really broadened my musical awareness extensively. The motif signature naturally comes from the world of opera.

    Bathory interview
    Interesting to see this from one of underground metal's founders.
    the Dark Legions Archive underground metal reviews

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    Quote Originally Posted by Conservationist View Post
    Interesting to see this from one of underground metal's founders.
    Yeah, for sure. There are a myriad of examples along the lines of the above interview which point to direct classical influence on metal. While many bands capture the spirit of classical in a modern context, some certainly had and have academic knowledge of it and how to play it. Examples of various kinds of direct influence I can think of:

    Ideological:

    - Varg Vikernes' (creator of Burzum) comments on rock music as essentially flashy blues; his subsequent transition to medieval ambient folk music
    - Faust of Emperor's name

    Theoretical:

    - Luc Lemay of Gorguts' degree in theory and appreciation of Bach, etc.
    - Crimson Massacre's lack of repetition within songs, formal classical training of band members
    - Rob Darken's (Graveland, Lord Wind) love for the Conan the Barbarian soundtrack, a classical film score which directly inspired the structure of his pieces
    - Celtic Frost's musical triptych at the end of Monotheist, particularly the part of the Requiem, which actually is full-on classical music that puts any Prokofiev suite to shame and was initially intended to be a part of a three-movement Requiem in itself
    - Pantheist (see below) - their incorporation of Baroque organ and Romantic piano, including reworkings of pieces by Chopin and a clear Bach influence
    - Cliff Burton's Bach-inspired bass solo on Kill 'Em All; his formal classical training

    Aesthetic:

    - Ildjarn's Hardangervidda, (orchestra-like synth strings)
    - Emperor's Opus a Satana, an orchestral take on Inno a Satana
    - Summoning - strings, proud horns and trumpets echoing the sounds of ancient battlefields
    - Ras Algethi, Pantheist, other funeral doom bands - adoption of Gregorian chant, strings, piano
    - Black Sabbath's being influenced by horror film soundtracks


    This is a very small list that I came up with off the top of my head. I know I'm leaving a lot out.

    Most people aren't aware of the influence of classical on metal, but that's because they think AC/DC, Judas Priest, Slipknot, Cannibal Corpse, and Dragonforce are actual metal bands. Time to enlighten them. Fans of metal music, add more!
    Last edited by Dedrater; Jul-16-2009 at 10:31.

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    Most people here aren't concerned with facts. They just want a reason to sound cool to compensate for their failing lives. Cognitive dissonance, as always. It's one of the snipiest forums I've been on, because being able to claim you're a classical fan makes you seem smarter than the average person. They're all jockeying for that status, probably between answering tech support calls.
    the Dark Legions Archive underground metal reviews

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    Quote Originally Posted by Conservationist View Post
    Most people here aren't concerned with facts. They just want a reason to sound cool to compensate for their failing lives. Cognitive dissonance, as always. It's one of the snipiest forums I've been on, because being able to claim you're a classical fan makes you seem smarter than the average person. They're all jockeying for that status, probably between answering tech support calls.
    I agree.

    This reality only makes Michael Jackson and Beatles topics all the more baffling here, though. I guess it's an attempt to condescend to the idea of unofficial, non-canonical music as inherently frivolous and for 'fun.' If Stravinsky employs radical techniques just for the hell of it rather than because he has something to say, that's fine, because he's coming from within the tradition. If a subculture of circus performances and parlor tricks springs up in the African American community like jazz, well, that's unserious entertainment-music. Besides, affirmative action says that everyone, regardless of competency at expressing something strong and real, deserves a place in the school textbooks. But when something blatantly and violently opposed to this idea itself emerges, it's obviously not going to fly.

    In a way, it's like donating to charity without understanding the political reasons for why poverty exists, all the while only mingling with societal elites.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dedrater View Post
    This reality only makes Michael Jackson and Beatles topics all the more baffling here, though.
    I think there's a lot of people here who want to appear elite. They also want to be ironic, because that way they appear more unique. Classical = elite, likes Michael Jackson = ironic, interesting.

    Or so they think.

    Then there's a lot of people, who are generally lurking and reading the classical forums, who just want to pick up information or feel in the loop. I'd consider myself one in regards to classical music, since I have a few solid favorites and don't know many of the rarities.

    It's interesting however how the patterns from metal forums repeat here:

    The faux elitists -- only accept music that adheres to certain arbitrary standards that "look" rigorous.

    The omnivores -- pandering to the crowd, they want to appear humble, so they like everything and have no favorites.

    The one-uppers -- will always name something more obscure, even if it sucks, and claim it's genius.

    We can already see the reasons for it. While metal fans get pompous because they work changing tires, have doomed themselves by drug problems, or are powerless students, people here get pompous because their careers failed, they're lonely, or are unsure of their position in society since they know they're from a politically privileged group. But that's the minority. The quiet ones are the balanced ones, I think.

    It's interesting how nasty this forum is. It's on par with the really elitist metal communities -- the same sniping nastiness as people jockey for status. Really grade-school, when you think about it.
    the Dark Legions Archive underground metal reviews

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    Senior Member Bach's Avatar
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    Have you ever considered that the reason many classical and jazz listeners hate metal is because it is musically simple and sounds bad?

    (please don't continue to assume I haven't heard any - I've heard quite a lot, mostly on your recommendation)
    Si vos agnosco is tunc vos es quoque erudio

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bach View Post
    Have you ever considered that the reason many classical and jazz listeners hate metal is because it is musically simple and sounds bad?
    If those listeners expressed any familiarity with the genre whatsoever, I might accept that.

    But they do not.
    the Dark Legions Archive underground metal reviews

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    I'm a trained musician, I've heard metal songs - harmonically, melodically, improvisationally and rhythmically they are fairly simple. I've analysed it in enough detail to work that out.
    Si vos agnosco is tunc vos es quoque erudio

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bach View Post
    I'm a trained musician, I've heard metal songs - harmonically, melodically, improvisationally and rhythmically they are fairly simple. I've analysed it in enough detail to work that out.
    There's huge variance among metal genres. What were these songs?
    the Dark Legions Archive underground metal reviews

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    The ones you recommended to me. Burzum, Atheist and things like that..
    Si vos agnosco is tunc vos es quoque erudio

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    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=luFCBdS5PAs

    There is no music in this - it's horrendously repetitive (and not even a particularly interesting idea in the first place) and the vocalist can't sing a note.. I can't understand how someone who appreciates classical music can think this is good.. musically or aesthetically.
    Si vos agnosco is tunc vos es quoque erudio

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bach View Post
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=luFCBdS5PAs

    There is no music in this - it's horrendously repetitive (and not even a particularly interesting idea in the first place) and the vocalist can't sing a note.. I can't understand how someone who appreciates classical music can think this is good.. musically or aesthetically.
    My, that was awful. And I am not just saying that to be inflammatory.

    I agree 110% with Bach...I am surprised anyone who has a taste for even the most bombastic and in-your-face classical music could find this 1) appealing and 2) anything like anything in the classical repertoire.

    Anyone attempting to tie the two genres together should not use this music as an example. It sounds to have more in common with regular rock music with a fairly consistant beat, lack of counterpoint and repeated power chord electric guitar riffs.

    What exactly does this have in common with Schubert?

    And I guess the runes are supposed to ekove ancient Aryan culture or something...epic, dude!
    "Music is not philosophy." --Akira Ifukube

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tapkaara View Post
    And I guess the runes are supposed to ekove ancient Aryan culture or something...epic, dude!
    That is one of the best things I've read on this forum for ages - that's the crux of it! That's exactly what the metalheads are thinking (but they apply some pseudointellectual 'cultural' bracket over it instead.) Well said, Tappy.
    Si vos agnosco is tunc vos es quoque erudio

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