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Thread: What represents the peak of Mozart's works to you?

  1. #76
    Senior Member fluteman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bulldog View Post
    I suppose it's just me, but I find the piano concertos after no. 24 a little disappointing.
    I wouldn't say it's just you, there are those who don't care for Beethoven's 9th symphony, Shakespeare's Hamlet, van Gogh's Starry Night, Tolstoy's War and Peace, etc.

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    Senior Member Strange Magic's Avatar
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    Whenever I listen to the PC #24 opening movement (I have and love the Gould), I am strangely and portentously reminded of the beginning of the Brahms #1 PC.

  3. #78
    Senior Member Luchesi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by fluteman View Post
    For me, all of Mozart's piano concerti, but especially nos. 19-27, represent one of the highest points in all western music. I should have included them with the mature chamber music, the last six symphonies and the operas in my initial post. In that august final group of 19-27, all are justly celebrated as masterpieces, but if one is underrated, perhaps it is the F major, no. 19. If so, that would be a terrible mistake. One of the earliest classical records to have a profound impact on me as an 8 or 9 year-old was Clara Haskil's astounding performance of no. 19 with Ferenc Fricsay on DG. But when I bought the CD from the "DG Originals" series, it was dreadful, one of the few bad digital transfers in that fine series. If anyone knows of a digital version that is better, please let me know. Not that Mitsuko Uchida or Murray Perahia are so bad.
    To me this sounds okay for that long ago.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nUHQFxjrg5c

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    Senior Member flamencosketches's Avatar
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    OK, I haven't heard the 24th concerto and it sounds like I'm missing out. Whose should I check out? I'm a big fan of Gould but I'm skeptical of him playing Mozart.

  5. #80
    Senior Member fluteman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Luchesi View Post
    To me this sounds okay for that long ago.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nUHQFxjrg5c
    Compare that with this. It's the same recording.

  6. #81
    Senior Member fluteman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by flamencosketches View Post
    OK, I haven't heard the 24th concerto and it sounds like I'm missing out. Whose should I check out? I'm a big fan of Gould but I'm skeptical of him playing Mozart.
    Did you see the box set I just wrote about? It includes Haskil's famous recording of the 24th with Markevitch, in stereo no less.

  7. #82
    Senior Member hammeredklavier's Avatar
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    "I always find Beethoven's C Minor concerto (the Third Piano Concerto) much smaller and weaker than Mozart's. . . . I realize that Beethoven's new personality and his new vision, which people recognized in his works, made him the greater composer in their minds. But after fifty years, our views need more perspective. One must be able to distinguish between the charm that comes from newness and the value that is intrinsic to a work. I admit that Beethoven's concerto is more modern, but not more significant!
    I also realize that Beethoven's First Symphony made a strong impression on people. That's the nature of a new vision. But the last three Mozart symphonies are far more significant. . . . Yes, the Rasumovsky quartets, the later symphonies—these inhabit a significant new world, one already hinted at in his Second Symphony. But what is much weaker in Beethoven compared to Mozart, and especially compared to Sebastian Bach, is the use of dissonance. Dissonance, true dissonance as Mozart used it, is not to be found in Beethoven. Look at Idomeneo. Not only is it a marvel, but as Mozart was still quite young and brash when he wrote it, it was a completely new thing. What marvelous dissonance! What harmony! You couldn't commission great music from Beethoven since he created only lesser works on commission—his more conventional pieces, his variations and the like. When Haydn or Mozart wrote on commission, it was the same as their other works."
    -JOHANNES BRAHMS

    https://books.google.ca/books?id=7iw...page&q&f=false
    https://books.google.ca/books?id=7iw...page&q&f=false
    Last edited by hammeredklavier; Jan-24-2019 at 11:16.

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  9. #83
    Senior Member Ras's Avatar
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    Default Mozart's piano concertos - 24th. Recommended recordings.

    Quote Originally Posted by flamencosketches View Post
    OK, I haven't heard the 24th concerto and it sounds like I'm missing out. Whose should I check out? I'm a big fan of Gould but I'm skeptical of him playing Mozart.
    ON MODERN INSTRUMENTS:

    Imogen Cooper on Avie.

    Alfred Brendel with Marriner on Decca and the same Alfred Brendel with Charles Mackerras on Phillips.

    Andras Schiff on Decca.

    Barenboim with the Berlin Philharmonic on Warner he plays Mozart with a strong romantic flavor. Not to anyone's taste, but I like it.

    ON PERIOD INSTRUMENTS:

    Among recordings on period instruments I like Bilson with Gardiner on Archiv/DG and Jos van Immerseel on Channel records.

    (You mention Gould - I've never heard it, so can't comment on that.)

    You can hear most of these recordings on www.spotify.com

    I can post links and pictures on request, - I'm too lazy to do it right now.
    "I only have a hunch in what I've become expert." - Leonard Cohen

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  11. #84
    Senior Member fluteman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ras View Post
    ON MODERN INSTRUMENTS:

    Imogen Cooper on Avie.

    Alfred Brendel with Marriner on Decca and the same Alfred Brendel with Charles Mackerras on Phillips.

    Andras Schiff on Decca.

    Barenboim with the Berlin Philharmonic on Warner he plays Mozart with a strong romantic flavor. Not to anyone's taste, but I like it.

    ON PERIOD INSTRUMENTS:

    Among recordings on period instruments I like Bilson with Gardiner on Archiv/DG and Jos van Immerseel on Channel records.

    (You mention Gould - I've never heard it, so can't comment on that.)

    You can hear most of these recordings on www.spotify.com

    I can post links and pictures on request, - I'm too lazy to do it right now.
    Also, Sir Clifford Curzon with the London Symphony Orchestra and István Kertész on Decca. Curzon was superb with Mozart. He recorded no. 24 several times, I'm not sure they are all so easy to find. And by the way, this is the LSO with principal violist Neville Marriner, principal hornist Barry Tuckwell, principal flutist James Galway, and in general a very strong orchestra.
    Last edited by fluteman; Jan-24-2019 at 15:41.

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  13. #85
    Senior Member Ras's Avatar
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    Thumbs up

    Quote Originally Posted by fluteman View Post
    Also, Sir Clifford Curzon with the London Symphony Orchestra and István Kertész on Decca. Curzon was superb with Mozart. He recorded no. 24 several times, I'm not sure they are all so easy to find. And by the way, this is the LSO with principal violist Neville Marriner, principal hornist Barry Tuckwell, principal flutist James Galway, and in general a very strong orchestra.
    Thanks fluteman

    Are these the Curzon recordings you recommend:

    CurzonMozart.jpg

    CurzonMozartback.jpg

    principal violist Neville Marriner, principal hornist Barry Tuckwell, principal flutist James Galway
    A pretty "posh" lineup, huh?
    "I only have a hunch in what I've become expert." - Leonard Cohen

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    Anyone like Muti/Richter in 491?

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    Senior Member fluteman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ras View Post
    Thanks fluteman

    Are these the Curzon recordings you recommend:

    CurzonMozart.jpg

    CurzonMozartback.jpg



    A pretty "posh" lineup, huh?
    Yes. I'm not prepared to comment on the differences between the various Curzon versions of all of these concertos, as I'm sure some pianophiles could readily do. But these are classics.

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    Quote Originally Posted by fluteman View Post
    Yes. I'm not prepared to comment on the differences between the various Curzon versions of all of these concertos, as I'm sure some pianophiles could readily do. But these are classics.
    I'm not sure, I remember thinking that if you want Curzon in this there are nights on record with 491 where he was less nervous and tense, with Kubelik for example. Or with Giullini (though I'm not sure if that's ever been available commercially) It's many years since I last listened to these recordings. When he was feeling relaxed and inspired he was well worth hearing, but unfortunately he had all sorts of problems which sometimes got in the way.
    Last edited by Mandryka; Jan-24-2019 at 17:15.

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  19. #89
    Junior Member anahit's Avatar
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    Jupiter, the last movement.

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  21. #90
    Senior Member fluteman's Avatar
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    I like the Kertesz version more than the Kubelik version, which is sometimes a bit too relaxed for me. But I agree, you can strike gold if you're willing to search around a bit. I taped a live performance of his of no. 23 that's wonderful.

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