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Thread: Successful Quartet Group, Violist most impoartnt link

  1. #16
    Senior Member millionrainbows's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by edwardbast View Post
    this is a nonsensical theory based on nothing. It is especially ridiculous for the first fifty years of the string quartet.
    Varnung! Ad hominems are not allowed! Stop playing on the border! This is your last warning!
    Last edited by millionrainbows; Aug-01-2019 at 12:44.
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  2. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by millionrainbows View Post
    Varnung! Ad hominems are not allowed! Stop playing on the border! This is your last warning!
    yeah, good one...here's my theory,,,why do we all have 2,3,4 + copies of our fav composers SQ's sitting on our shelf,,,in search of the ideal 10/10 performance?

    Its because the violist is shabby and hiding behind superior violinists. and I am also calling out all the shabby cellists on our multiple SQ's sets sitting , collecting dust on your shelf.
    2 great violins can not carry the show you know,,,a 4 wheeler can not go very far in mountainous terrain on 2 good and 2 flat tires.
    Last edited by paulbest; Aug-01-2019 at 15:06.

  3. #18
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    You know while watching parts of this Bartok SQ by the famous Julliard SQ,,I can see what the issue is with Bartok SQ's.
    Note how each instrument is doing its own thing,,independent of each other,,,its almost like a work for 4 solists. at times. so to contect the 4 , takes quite a bit of talent, the work must have a sync , a linking of the 4 instruments parts.
    anything tenuous will show up rather quickly and one will begin to imagine the issues are with Bartok, as I falsely imagined in a post above.
    The issue is not at all with Bartok.
    The requirements of the 3rd Bartok SQ are rather Herculean , and for this reason most DSQ's can't make the thing *go*.
    I am sure we can locate many places in all 6 Bartok SQ's , where the instruments are *doing their own thing* as if he wrote for 4 virtuoso, and not so much as a tightly jointed blend of the 4 instruments.

    I gather this idea after seeing part of Beethoven's SQ op 132, on YT, where all the 4 players are closely in touch with each other,,,hardly any room for independence. They are all in support and connected.
    Whereas Bartok , at least in the 3rd, the 4 players have to be both individual and yet connected.
    Quite a challenge, which most SQ groups can not seem to meet this Herculean task.

  4. #19
    Senior Member mikeh375's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by paulbest View Post
    yeah, good one...here's my theory,,,why do we all have 2,3,4 + copies of our fav composers SQ's sitting on our shelf,,,in search of the ideal 10/10 performance?

    Its because the violist is shabby and hiding behind superior violinists. and I am also calling out all the shabby cellists on our multiple SQ's sets sitting , collecting dust on your shelf.
    2 great violins can not carry the show you know,,,a 4 wheeler can not go very far in mountainous terrain on 2 good and 2 flat tires.
    Paul, honestly, this is nonsense. Any 4tet working today professionally is exactly that, there is no tolerance for second rate.
    To play high end music in a 4tet needs virtuosity, expression and excellent ensemble from all four players, no 4tet will tolerate anything less in the pro world.
    Last edited by mikeh375; Aug-01-2019 at 15:31.

  5. #20
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    OK just revisited the famous Julliard SQ live perf of Bartok's 3rd SQ...now I clearly see what the issue is with his 3rd and no dout with the other 5.
    The 4 members have to be on the level of say, a David Oistrakh , or at the very least, Hillary Hahn. ,,anything less virtuoso will show up as weakness.
    These SQ's are perhaps more challenging that Schnittke's 4 SQ.s
    Looking at Beethoven;s last SQ, if we say Beethoven's is 5 out of 10 difficulty,,Bartok's is a 10/out of 10 rating for difficulty.

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    Quote Originally Posted by mikeh375 View Post
    Paul, honestly, this is nonsense. Any 4tet working today professionally is exactly that, there is no tolerance for second rate.
    To play high end music in a 4tet needs virtuosity, expression and excellent ensemble from all four players, no 4tet will tolerate anything less in the pro world.
    had you read my post #20, I would have explained what I mean to say.
    Please read post #20

    I mean, sure most Bartok SQ records are *admirable* , but I am always in search of excellence, something more than just *admirable*
    Last edited by paulbest; Aug-01-2019 at 15:35.

  7. #22
    Senior Member mikeh375's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by paulbest View Post
    had you read my post #20, I would have explained what I mean to say.
    Please read post #20

    I mean, sure most Bartok SQ records are *admirable* , but I am always in search of excellence, something more than just *admirable*
    I can't see into the future yet Paul, if I could, I'd write tomorrow's music now...
    Last edited by mikeh375; Aug-01-2019 at 15:41.

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  9. #23
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    Yeah, well here is my point, The reason why I could not finda descent Bartok set is due to the nature of his works,,
    ck out how easy this late Beethoven SQ is compared to Bartok's 3rd,,which is why there are 100+ Beethoven sets on amazon,,and only 10 Bartok and 8 of those 10 records are 7 stars OR LESS.
    = Bartok's are only for the Oistrakh's The Hahn virtuoso, any group can play Beethoven.



    Very simple




    Highly complex




    The Bartok 3rd is even more daunting than is his Hercelean 2nd.
    Last edited by paulbest; Aug-01-2019 at 16:30.

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