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Thread: RIP David Koch

  1. #346
    Senior Member Bulldog's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Strange Magic View Post
    I thought I was occasionally cynical. But some here raise cynicism to a high art. Can there not be actual, legitimate criticism of the electoral collage system in the 21st century?
    Of course, but the criticism ramped up greatly when Trump won the election. So much of what's going on in the USA is a reaction to Trump. He has had more impact on the country and the world in his first two years than Obama had in 8 years. It's rather depressing.

  2. #347
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jacck View Post
    yes, the threat from China is mostly technological
    https://www.foreignaffairs.com/artic...-out-invent-it
    the US academia is now crippled by this diversity cult, which thinks it is more important to hire by gender and skin color then by merit, thus reducing its competitivness and the right cuts finances for research. Neither the left nor the right has any strategic policy. And if the technology is researched, it should be carefully guarded from Chinese spies. I am not sure if it is a good idea to let Chinese students come to the US to study. I think only people from democratic countries should be allowed to study in the West, because those from the totalitarian states are mostly spies or complicit with the regime. But it is probably too late for that. I am still convinced that these dictatorial regimes are ultimately less productive than democratic societies and that the centrally planned mismanaging will hinder China a lot. So far they have invented nothing really fundamental. The 5G is just an extension of existing technologies.
    Based on direct experience in hiring, I can say that the claim that US science academia is in any way negatively affected by the desire to promote diversity is entirely unjustified. If "diversity" comes into play it at all, it is to differentiate between two candidates that are perceived as equally qualified. At my institution researchers from underrepresented groups were among the most outstanding performers. The problem US academic research has is dramatic funding cuts, resulting in the old guard protecting its territory and up and coming researchers finding a scorched earth funding landscape.

    If you try to eliminate Chinese students, the U.S. system would collapse. The U.S. primary education system is incapable of producing qualified science students.

  3. #348
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    Quote Originally Posted by Baron Scarpia View Post
    Based on direct experience in hiring, I can say that the claim that US science academia is in any way negatively affected by the desire to promote diversity is entirely unjustified. If "diversity" comes into play it at all, it is to differentiate between two candidates that are perceived as equally qualified. At my institution researchers from underrepresented groups were among the most outstanding performers. The problem US academic research has is dramatic funding cuts, resulting in the old guard protecting its territory and up and coming researchers finding a scorched earth funding landscape.

    If you try to eliminate Chinese students, the U.S. system would collapse. The U.S. primary education system is incapable of producing qualified science students.
    So we just allow them to come here and steal technology from us.
    "A government big enough to give you everything you want, is a government big enough to take away everything that you have." Thomas Jefferson

  4. #349
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    Quote Originally Posted by Johnnie Burgess View Post
    So we just allow them to come here and steal technology from us.
    We are a generous country; Trump would say way too generous.

  5. #350
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    Quote Originally Posted by Johnnie Burgess View Post
    So we just allow them to come here and steal technology from us.
    You can accuse them of stealing what they created. They come here, do great work, create valuable technology, and when their visas are not renewed and they have to return, of course they remember what they learned and created. It is our stupidity to make it difficult for them to stay. Without immigrant scientists and technologists the U.S. would not be a technology leader at all.

  6. #351
    Senior Member Jacck's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Baron Scarpia View Post
    If you try to eliminate Chinese students, the U.S. system would collapse. The U.S. primary education system is incapable of producing qualified science students.
    Quote Originally Posted by Baron Scarpia View Post
    You can accuse them of stealing what they created. They come here, do great work, create valuable technology, and when their visas are not renewed and they have to return, of course they remember what they learned and created. It is our stupidity to make it difficult for them to stay. Without immigrant scientists and technologists the U.S. would not be a technology leader at all.
    you should treat China as an enemy. They are not going to show any gratitude after they gain the upper hand, and once they gain the upper hand, they will jealously guard their know-how and not share it with the westerners, just like they guarded their silk production secrets and the sharing of those secrets was punishable by death. China is employing huge armies of hackers and spies to steal military and industrial secrets
    https://nationalinterest.org/blog/th...stealing-18677
    and sending armies of students abroad to bring know-how back to China. If the primary education system is the problem, then reform it.

  7. #352
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    Quote Originally Posted by Baron Scarpia View Post
    You can accuse them of stealing what they created. They come here, do great work, create valuable technology, and when their visas are not renewed and they have to return, of course they remember what they learned and created. It is our stupidity to make it difficult for them to stay. Without immigrant scientists and technologists the U.S. would not be a technology leader at all.
    Those are some awful big assertions. Seriously, all new technology is thanks to immigrant labor? I doubt it. And regardless whether it is true, there are patents in place. China ignores international patent law. People change employment all the time. But patent laws prevent them from simply reproducing what they did at another company. The issue is not that Chinese are coming here and learning how to build things. The issue is that they return to China and purposely violate patent law. What is your solution? Prevent any Chinese person from ever being able to return to their home country for fear they will engage in industrial espionage? Or never let them come here in the first place?

  8. #353
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    Quote Originally Posted by Baron Scarpia View Post
    Based on direct experience in hiring, I can say that the claim that US science academia is in any way negatively affected by the desire to promote diversity is entirely unjustified. If "diversity" comes into play it at all, it is to differentiate between two candidates that are perceived as equally qualified. At my institution researchers from underrepresented groups were among the most outstanding performers. The problem US academic research has is dramatic funding cuts, resulting in the old guard protecting its territory and up and coming researchers finding a scorched earth funding landscape.

    If you try to eliminate Chinese students, the U.S. system would collapse. The U.S. primary education system is incapable of producing qualified science students.
    Given that I am a scientist who came through the U.S. system, have been in academic science since 1997, and have seen countless numbers of both foreign and American students enter, and successfully complete, training to become scientists, your final statement is utter crap. There are many Chinese scientists, it is true. They are by no means a majority. A great many end up just like others, working as postdocs and staff in larger labs. I don't know where you claim to get your data, but I am suspicious of your source.

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