Page 1 of 56 123451151 ... LastLast
Results 1 to 15 of 835

Thread: Will Atonal Compositions Last Centuries like Past Works?

  1. #1
    Senior Member Captainnumber36's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2017
    Posts
    5,674
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default Will Atonal Compositions Last Centuries like Past Works?

    What do you think? I've heard some works by I believe Schoenberg that I think will last, but I think several will be forgotten. Such works just don't tend to have memorable hooks like the big three, and other composers, obviously.



  2. #2
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jul 2017
    Posts
    735
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    If by "last" you mean will they become concert staples and popular, the answer is already no. But if by "last" do you mean will people continue to record them, maybe. The earlier music of the Second Viennese School is soon a century old so it is not exactly new. One thing is certain: I give anything that's made it thus far more chance of surviving in any concept than 99.7 percent of what is being composed today.

  3. Likes Captainnumber36, Johnnie Burgess liked this post
  4. #3
    Senior Member Captainnumber36's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2017
    Posts
    5,674
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by larold View Post
    If by "last" you mean will they become concert staples and popular, the answer is already no. But if by "last" do you mean will people continue to record them, maybe. The earlier music of the Second Viennese School is soon a century old so it is not exactly new. One thing is certain: I give anything that's made it thus far more chance of surviving in any concept than 99.7 percent of what is being composed today.
    I agree with you. Thanks for your comments!

  5. #4
    Senior Member Phil loves classical's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2017
    Location
    Ford Nation
    Posts
    4,134
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    They've lasted for a smaller audience, larger than that of Renaissance music I think. I suspect will continue to be more popular than Renaissance music.
    "Forgive me, Majesty. I'm a vulgar man. But I assure you, my music is not.“ Mozart

  6. Likes Manxfeeder, science liked this post
  7. #5
    Senior Member Bulldog's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2013
    Location
    Albuquerque, New Mexico
    Posts
    20,453
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    I can't think of any reason why atonal music wouldn't last for centuries.

  8. Likes Art Rock, science liked this post
  9. #6
    Senior Member Woodduck's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2014
    Posts
    14,349
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    If it's well-crafted and has found and kept an audience for a few decades, it will last. Very little of it is likely to be popular or performed often, but there are plenty of recordings and there will be more.

    It's hard to answer the part of the question that says "like past works," since our time is not like past times. Music composed since the invention of recording, especially in the multiple media of our time, can reach a much wider audience than music could in earlier times, and so it has a virtual guarantor that some one will remember it and want to hear it. Plenty of music, old and new, has survived which would otherwise be forgotten - or, in fact, already was forgotten until somebody unearthed it and recorded it. Mere survival isn't the mark of distinction it once was.
    Last edited by Woodduck; Aug-30-2019 at 22:06.

  10. Likes Resurrexit, SONNET CLV liked this post
  11. #7
    Senior Member Kjetil Heggelund's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2016
    Location
    Jevnaker, Norway
    Posts
    2,779
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Maybe everything will be remembered by those that care. F.ex. people that investigate the past, musicologists, historians and the likes. They dug up Perotin and Machaut and now everything is available pretty easily

  12. #8
    Senior Member MatthewWeflen's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2019
    Location
    Chicago
    Posts
    556
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Where is that "Michael Jackson Eating Popcorn" GIF when you need it?

  13. Likes mikeh375 liked this post
  14. #9
    Senior Member hammeredklavier's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2018
    Posts
    869
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Lots of them work well as music for horror film scenes. (I'm not making fun of them)
    I think that's where their artistry lies. They are still inventive in the way they can create certain emotions the music of the past could not. They just need be coupled with visual content to be 'convincing music'.

    Quote Originally Posted by hammeredklavier View Post
    For example, in this documentary the music played around 20:00~ 22:00 sounds somewhat like Stockhausen and helps instill emotions and atmosphere appropriate for the visual material. I can't think of any other type of music that can do this better."
    Last edited by hammeredklavier; Aug-31-2019 at 01:06.

  15. Likes science liked this post
  16. #10
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2016
    Location
    Gilbert, AZ
    Posts
    1,240
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Quick - name one, just one, atonal work that is in the standard orchestral repertoire.....can't do it, can you? That's because there are none. There are a few works that barely hang on but only because some conductors and orchestra feel an obligation to carry the torch for Schoenberg, Berg, Webern and their ilk. But audiences have made their preferences known both in terms of concerts and recordings. Sadly, concomitant with this is the narrowing of the repertoire in general. Summer festivals are practically indistinguishable from the regular season - it's the same old, tired, worn out tried-and-true Brahms, Beethoven, Tchaikovsky, Wagner...it's very discouraging. So like Kjetil said, atonal music is going to be known only to specialists.

    The reason is those "hooks". In my opinion, music must come from the heart - it must make an emotional connection to the listener. And the further music gets from folk songs, the harder it is for the average brain to understand, enjoy and love. Composers whose music makes a connection with the listener will always be around. It may disgust and anger atonal composers, but things like the Dvorak 9th, Tchaikovksy 5th, and Shostakovich 5th will always thrill and excite audiences. So will Sousa marches.

  17. Likes Johnnie Burgess, Mifek, FleshRobot and 1 others liked this post
  18. #11
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2015
    Posts
    1,894
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    The good ones, yes. The bad ones, no. Just like all other music.

  19. Likes Bulldog, Portamento, Manxfeeder liked this post
  20. #12
    Senior Member starthrower's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Location
    Syracuse, NY USA
    Posts
    10,513
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by hammeredklavier View Post
    They just need be coupled with visual content to be 'convincing music'.
    Nonsense. No visuals are going to elevate a lousy piece of music whether it's a tonal or atonal composition. All visuals do is distract one from listening closely to the content of the music. If anything is true, it's the complete opposite. Great music can elevate a film or program. This is why directors hire the best talent they can afford.

    No one knows the future, but there's no reason to believe music lovers won't be enjoying Berg's Lyric Suite, or Schoenberg's violin concerto a hundred years from now. Not to mention Takemitsu, Lutoslawski, Elliott Carter, and many others. As for what pieces will be accepted by general audiences in the year 2200. Who knows?
    Short-term thinkers are rewarded with reelection, while those who dare to take seriously our responsibility to future generations commonly find themselves out of office.

    - Marcia Bjornerud, Geologist

  21. #13
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    May 2014
    Location
    Paradise, Montana ... on
    Posts
    2,359
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by larold View Post
    If by "last" you mean will they become concert staples and popular, the answer is already no. But if by "last" do you mean will people continue to record them, maybe. The earlier music of the Second Viennese School is soon a century old so it is not exactly new. One thing is certain: I give anything that's made it thus far more chance of surviving in any concept than 99.7 percent of what is being composed today.
    As a devotee of contemporary music, I'd like to know what works are included in that .3 percent! I want to make sure I hear them before I die. Especially since I likely enjoy much of the other 99.7 percent!

  22. Likes starthrower, Mifek, Artran liked this post
  23. #14
    Senior Member KenOC's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    SoCal, USA
    Posts
    19,539
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    I'm sure that atonal works will last hundreds of years, maybe thousands. After all, they will never experience the wear and tear of too much listening.


  24. Likes regenmusic, Manxfeeder liked this post
  25. #15
    Senior Member Woodduck's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2014
    Posts
    14,349
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by mbhaub View Post
    Quick - name one, just one, atonal work that is in the standard orchestral repertoire.....can't do it, can you? That's because there are none.
    1.) How many works of any kind are in the "standard orchestral repertoire," and how much fine music is rarely programmed?

    2.) How many well-known atonal works are written for the standard symphony orchestra?
    Last edited by Woodduck; Aug-31-2019 at 04:11.

Page 1 of 56 123451151 ... LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •