Page 244 of 295 FirstFirst ... 144194234240241242243244245246247248254294 ... LastLast
Results 3,646 to 3,660 of 4425

Thread: Weekly quartet. Just a music lover perspective.

  1. #3646
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Posts
    9,088
    Post Thanks / Like
    Blog Entries
    2

    Default

    I like the quartet and it’s true that this thread has revived my interest in Ferneyhough - but NOT the quartets in fact. I’ve been really enjoying two things this week - an early mass, The Missa Brevis. And a very late cycle called Umbrations.

    I like early Ferneyhough a lot. I think the early music is bold and thrilling and totally “unbuttoned” in a 1960s way. The later music like the 6th quartet is very fine, crafted with skill and is in some ways rather austere and serious.

    I enthusiastically recommend the Missa Brevis to anyone who has the stomach for, e.g., the Ligetti Requiem or Barraqué’s Le Temps Restitué (but Ferneyhough is better than Barraqué) or Sciarrino’s madrigals.
    Last edited by Mandryka; Jul-22-2021 at 09:29.

  2. #3647
    Senior Member Bwv 1080's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2018
    Posts
    1,068
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by HenryPenfold View Post
    I'm struggling. Always have done, with Ferneyhough. I am accustomed to listening to the music of composers such as Lachenmann, Birtwistle, Cage, Crumb, Boulez et al, and I always find something appealing and captivating. But somehow Ferneyhough leaves me cold.

    As a serious music fan, I of course have approached his music with an open, enquiring and curious mind and a number of years ago, before streaming and when little or nothing was available on YouTube etc, I bought a CD (see below) of his music and spent a fair amount of time listening to it. But, I'm afraid his art eludes me.




    That is a great disc - his cycle of chamber concertos (La Chute, Terrain, Allgebrah, Les Froissments) are some of my favorite pieces

  3. Likes HenryPenfold, Malx, Knorf liked this post
  4. #3648
    Senior Member allaroundmusicenthusiast's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2020
    Location
    Good Airs, Argentina
    Posts
    1,770
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Allegro Con Brio View Post
    New Complexity. What is it? Is it the Yang to Minimalism’s Yin? What is it trying to do? Does it have an ironic side or is it dead serious? Should performers strive for complete accuracy in all the details of the incredibly dense scores? Just trying to start a discussion.
    For me, you just cannot enjoy this music being wholly serious, at one point the levee breaks, and when the levee breaks I'll have no place to stay (god I haven't listened to Zeppelin in 10 years and I still remember the lyrics). Even if it from the part of the composer or from the performers, the pieces of this style that I love are those in which I can find something emotional to latch on to, and you can't have emotion, humour included, while being absolutely dead serious. That's just not a right approach

  5. Likes Bwv 1080, Portamento liked this post
  6. #3649
    Senior Member Allegro Con Brio's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2020
    Location
    USA
    Posts
    3,319
    Post Thanks / Like
    Blog Entries
    2

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Mandryka View Post
    How you enjoying the quartet?
    An interesting and even fun listen, but not the kind of thing I would return to repeatedly for pleasure. A great choice for this thread though!
    "If we understood the world, we would realize that there is a logic of harmony underlying its manifold apparent dissonances." - Jean Sibelius

    "Art is an attempt to transport into a limited quantity of matter, modeled by man, an image of the infinite beauty of the entire universe." - Simone Weil

    "Ceaseless work, analysis, reflection, writing much, endless self-correction, that is my secret." - Johann Sebastian Bach

  7. Likes Knorf liked this post
  8. #3650
    Senior Member starthrower's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Location
    Syracuse, NY USA
    Posts
    14,327
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Allegro Con Brio View Post
    An interesting and even fun listen, but not the kind of thing I would return to repeatedly for pleasure. A great choice for this thread though!
    About the same for me. I listened to the quartet a couple times through and I made an attempt to get through Terrain from that Kairos CD. It's just too many notes for my taste. Too much nervous and hyperactivity. I'm more drawn to stuff like Saariaho, Ligeti, and the French spectral composers. When I listen to Ferneyhough it sounds like a guy who needs to get out for some fresh air more often. That said, I'm in favor of every kind of music imaginable to flourish sufficiently for the audience that enjoys it. And in the future I may discover a piece or two by Ferneyhough that really clicks. I like to keep an open mind about these things.
    "In the beginning there was noise. And the noise begat rhythm. And the rhythm begat everything else." - Mickey Hart

  9. Likes Malx liked this post
  10. #3651
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Posts
    9,088
    Post Thanks / Like
    Blog Entries
    2

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by starthrower View Post
    It's just too many notes for my taste. Too much nervous and hyperactivity. .
    Yes, this is something I can see. Busy music like that seems to be really out of style. I listened to some Richard Barrett recently, something he released a few months ago, and it's full of notes and I thought to myself, this sounds like it was written in the 20th century or something! As outmoded as total serialism.

    Ferneyhough's an old man. Roll over Ferneyhough.
    Last edited by Mandryka; Jul-22-2021 at 15:45.

  11. #3652
    Senior Member starthrower's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Location
    Syracuse, NY USA
    Posts
    14,327
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Mandryka View Post
    Yes, this is something I can see. Busy music like that seems to be really out of style. I listened to some Richard Barrett recently, something he released a few months ago, and it's full of notes and I thought to myself, this sounds like it was written in the 20th century or something! As outmoded as total serialism.

    Ferneyhough's an old man. Roll over Ferneyhough.
    I don't want to sound too general about this because every piece is different. And as was mentioned by you or another member, complexity, or even simplicity should be irrelevant as long as the end result resonates with the listener. Carter wrote busy, complicated music but there are a number of pieces I enjoy and others I've failed to appreciate. As far as Ferneyhough is concerned I haven't listened to very many pieces so I may in fact connect with some of his music if I keep trying different works.
    "In the beginning there was noise. And the noise begat rhythm. And the rhythm begat everything else." - Mickey Hart

  12. #3653
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Posts
    9,088
    Post Thanks / Like
    Blog Entries
    2

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by starthrower View Post
    I don't want to sound too general about this because every piece is different. And as was mentioned by you or another member, complexity, or even simplicity should be irrelevant as long as the end result resonates with the listener. Carter wrote busy, complicated music but there are a number of pieces I enjoy and others I've failed to appreciate. As far as Ferneyhough is concerned I haven't listened to very many pieces so I may in fact connect with some of his music if I keep trying different works.
    Like Carter Ferneyhough’s music is often contrapuntal. I must say, I much prefer Ferneyhough to Carter!

    For me, one serious limitation in Ferneyhough is the total absence of engagement with the world. This is a marked contrast to, for example, Finnissy or Stockhausen or Cage. It’s as if for Ferneyhough music is an abstract thing, just organised sound.

    That being said, I’ve never managed to make head or tale of all that Deleuzian stuff he writes, and I’ve never made any sense of the opera either.
    Last edited by Mandryka; Jul-22-2021 at 16:09.

  13. #3654
    Senior Member Bwv 1080's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2018
    Posts
    1,068
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    For some reason Ferneyhough was always more accessible than Carter, which was an acquired taste for me. First time I heard Ferneyhough (La Chute) I was hooked.

    Heard New Complexity described somewhere as 'late high modernism' , which seems as good a description as any

  14. Likes starthrower liked this post
  15. #3655
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Posts
    9,088
    Post Thanks / Like
    Blog Entries
    2

    Default

    We should do one of those duel poll threads which used to be popular here - Mozart v. Haydn, Beethoven v Led Zeppelin, Ferneyhough v Carter!

  16. Likes StevehamNY liked this post
  17. #3656
    Senior Member starthrower's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Location
    Syracuse, NY USA
    Posts
    14,327
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Bwv 1080 View Post
    First time I heard Ferneyhough (La Chute) I was hooked.
    You've pointed me in the right direction! I just gave this a listen and it sounds great to my ears. Perhaps I should steer clear of the string pieces for now and listen to more stuff like this? I love winds and percussion. I find this piece a lot more fun to listen to than the hyper busy string writing.
    "In the beginning there was noise. And the noise begat rhythm. And the rhythm begat everything else." - Mickey Hart

  18. Likes Bwv 1080, Malx liked this post
  19. #3657
    Senior Member Malx's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2017
    Location
    Scotland
    Posts
    5,646
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by starthrower View Post
    You've pointed me in the right direction! I just gave this a listen and it sounds great to my ears. Perhaps I should steer clear of the string pieces for now and listen to more stuff like this? I love winds and percussion. I find this piece a lot more fun to listen to than the hyper busy string writing.
    I too have just listened to La Chute and find it much more agreeable, the combination of winds and percussion for me makes the piece sound less dense and the structure becomes easier for me to hear. This is not a flippant point but the shorter length also helps me as a newby in Fernyhough's world.
    To bring it back to the thread - I am glad to have the opportunity to have tried the quartet but can't get anything from it but as a result of the discussions I have now found a work I can enjoy.
    Last edited by Malx; Jul-22-2021 at 17:18.

  20. Likes Bwv 1080 liked this post
  21. #3658
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2016
    Posts
    3,136
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by allaroundmusicenthusiast View Post
    For me, you just cannot enjoy this music being wholly serious, at one point the levee breaks, and when the levee breaks I'll have no place to stay (god I haven't listened to Zeppelin in 10 years and I still remember the lyrics).
    Exactly. The premise is so deliberately absurd that I cannot imagine taking it too seriously.

    Quote Originally Posted by Bwv 1080 View Post
    Heard New Complexity described somewhere as 'late high modernism' , which seems as good a description as any
    I've even seen it described as postmodernism, which actually makes sense when you realize that Ferneyhough's aesthetic of 'fidelity, not accuracy' is at odds with many figures of high modernism. Music historians are increasingly referring to the period since ca. 1980 as "second/reflexive modernism." Postmodernism, which is already somewhat out of style, would fall under that.

    Quote Originally Posted by starthrower View Post
    It's just too many notes for my taste. Too much nervous and hyperactivity. I'm more drawn to stuff like Saariaho, Ligeti, and the French spectral composers. When I listen to Ferneyhough it sounds like a guy who needs to get out for some fresh air more often.
    I'm also a "less is more" type of guy. But I'm not bothered by this quartet in particular because I feel like the hyperactive moments are nicely balanced with some (relatively) tranquil parts.
    Last edited by Portamento; Jul-22-2021 at 17:23.

  22. #3659
    Senior Member starthrower's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Location
    Syracuse, NY USA
    Posts
    14,327
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Portamento View Post
    I'm also a "less is more" type of guy. But I'm not bothered by this quartet in particular because I feel like the hyperactive moments are nicely balanced with some (relatively) tranquil parts.
    Agreed! That's what I was hearing as I listened to the 6th quartet. If the right balance is achieved I can keep listening for longer periods.
    "In the beginning there was noise. And the noise begat rhythm. And the rhythm begat everything else." - Mickey Hart

  23. #3660
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Posts
    9,088
    Post Thanks / Like
    Blog Entries
    2

    Default

    Scarecrow's review of the box of quartets for amazon has some typically interesting comments -- this seems to me spot on

    . . . The schema here [in the 5th quartet] is how the "fragment" can come to inhabit larger spaces,what the "fragment" implies for development---- as the "Exordium", a satellite work also herein----,that moves from moment to moment in a "jouissance" of the moment- without cause for what may happen downstream. . . .
    As we approach the precipice of the expanded Sixth String Quartet, well now we have expressive personas,larger shapes that re-claim lost territory, as the Cello that opens the Sixth,its ascending" arrogance" and well into it, not till Bar 32, does his unrelenting voice stop,joining others "Other" argument end with his brethren also filing a claim. .
    These quartets are fragmentary -- like musics by Kurtag and Nono and Kagel and Holliger and Lachenmann. Fragments, moments musicaux, everywhere.

    Someone was asking me what I saw in the cello part and I refused to answer. Scarecrow has an answer, though what he hears as arrogance I don't.
    Last edited by Mandryka; Jul-22-2021 at 17:44.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •