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Thread: Met To Close For a Year

  1. #31
    Senior Member DavidA's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Revitalized Classics View Post
    Solti is dead 23 years...
    Yes and we do Mozart better than we did in his day.

  2. #32
    Senior Member amfortas's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Conte View Post
    That doesn't stop people getting into opera though. If they don't like the singing, they can always look at the singers!
    Not always a rewarding prospect.
    Alan

  3. #33
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    Can someone explain to me how we now sing Mozart better than before? Did singers back in Mozart's days have wobbly voices, thick sound and mushy vowels? Did they have undevelopped chest voices and uncoordinated registers? Did they have voices which lacked squillo and the ability to declamate? Did soprani screamed the high Fs in the Magic Flute with their constricted throats? Because if so, then we have indeed managed to equal they prowesses and are now singing Mozart much better than during Callas's time. Thank God for modern times!

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  5. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by DavidA View Post
    Yes and we do Mozart better than we did in his day.
    We'll find out soon enough when Nezet-Seguin conducts Le Nozze di Figaro at the Met in April 2022.
    Figaro: Christian Van Horn
    Susanna: Aida Garifullina
    Conte d'Almaviva: Gerald Finley
    Contessa d'Almaviva: Federica Lombardi
    Cherubino: Sasha Cooke
    Bartolo: Maurizio Muraro
    Marcellina: Elizabeth Bishop.

    You swear it will not just match but easily exceed Solti's performances at the Paris Opera in 1973 or 1980 with
    Figaro: Jose van Dam
    Susanna: Mirella Freni / Lucia Popp
    Conte d'Almaviva: Tom Krause
    Contessa d'Almaviva: Gundula Janowitz
    Cherubino: Frederica von Stade
    Bartolo: Kurt Moll
    Marcellina: Jane Berbie.

    In the meantime...

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  7. #35
    Senior Member adriesba's Avatar
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    ^ ^ ^ I'm not very familiar with Mozart opera to add anything to this discussion, but . . . Lucia Popp and Gundula Janowitz cannot be exceeded!
    Last edited by adriesba; Sep-29-2020 at 01:58.

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  9. #36
    Senior Member DavidA's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Parsifal98 View Post
    Can someone explain to me how we now sing Mozart better than before? Did singers back in Mozart's days have wobbly voices, thick sound and mushy vowels? Did they have undevelopped chest voices and uncoordinated registers? Did they have voices which lacked squillo and the ability to declamate? Did soprani screamed the high Fs in the Magic Flute with their constricted throats? Because if so, then we have indeed managed to equal they prowesses and are now singing Mozart much better than during Callas's time. Thank God for modern times!
    I was listening to Così last night and haven’t the faintest idea of what you are talking about

  10. #37
    Senior Member DavidA's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Revitalized Classics View Post
    We'll find out soon enough when Nezet-Seguin conducts Le Nozze di Figaro at the Met in April 2022.
    Figaro: Christian Van Horn
    Susanna: Aida Garifullina
    Conte d'Almaviva: Gerald Finley
    Contessa d'Almaviva: Federica Lombardi
    Cherubino: Sasha Cooke
    Bartolo: Maurizio Muraro
    Marcellina: Elizabeth Bishop.

    You swear it will not just match but easily exceed Solti's performances at the Paris Opera in 1973 or 1980 with
    Figaro: Jose van Dam
    Susanna: Mirella Freni / Lucia Popp
    Conte d'Almaviva: Tom Krause
    Contessa d'Almaviva: Gundula Janowitz
    Cherubino: Frederica von Stade
    Bartolo: Kurt Moll
    Marcellina: Jane Berbie.

    In the meantime...
    Come off it! I made a generalised statement and not a statement on specific casts. The fact is we do Mozart better. You can pick on a stellar cast of course from the past but I’m talking as a generalised role in style and in general performance.
    I could go back and take a specific Wagner cast from the past and compare it with the best we have from the present and swear we do that better today. We are talking about generalisations not specifics. I said we do Mozart better not every performance is cast better. Today we can generally go to a Mozart opera and find it will be well sung by young singers who look appropriate and conducted in a fashion that is suitable
    Last edited by DavidA; Sep-29-2020 at 08:01.

  11. #38
    Senior Member Rogerx's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Revitalized Classics View Post
    We'll find out soon enough when Nezet-Seguin conducts Le Nozze di Figaro at the Met in April 2022.
    Figaro: Christian Van Horn
    Susanna: Aida Garifullina
    Conte d'Almaviva: Gerald Finley
    Contessa d'Almaviva: Federica Lombardi
    Cherubino: Sasha Cooke
    Bartolo: Maurizio Muraro
    Marcellina: Elizabeth Bishop.

    You swear it will not just match but easily exceed Solti's performances at the Paris Opera in 1973 or 1980 with
    Figaro: Jose van Dam
    Susanna: Mirella Freni / Lucia Popp
    Conte d'Almaviva: Tom Krause
    Contessa d'Almaviva: Gundula Janowitz
    Cherubino: Frederica von Stade
    Bartolo: Kurt Moll
    Marcellina: Jane Berbie.

    In the meantime...

    I have seen that live in Paris
    “Never argue with an idiot. They will drag you down to their level and beat you with experience.” ― Mark Twain

    "Liberté, égalité, fraternité"

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  13. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rogerx View Post
    I have seen that live in Paris
    I'm so envious!

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  15. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by DavidA View Post
    Come off it! I made a generalised statement and not a statement on specific casts. The fact is we do Mozart better. You can pick on a stellar cast of course from the past but I’m talking as a generalised role in style and in general performance.
    I could go back and take a specific Wagner cast from the past and compare it with the best we have from the present and swear we do that better today. We are talking about generalisations not specifics. I said we do Mozart better not every performance is cast better. Today we can generally go to a Mozart opera and find it will be well sung by young singers who look appropriate and conducted in a fashion that is suitable
    When are you saying Mozart operas were populated with decrepit singers who looked inappropriate and the conducting was unsuitable?

  16. #41
    Senior Member DavidA's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Revitalized Classics View Post
    When are you saying Mozart operas were populated with decrepit singers who looked inappropriate and the conducting was unsuitable?
    Can I ask you where I said that?

  17. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by DavidA View Post
    Can I ask you where I said that?
    "The fact is we do Mozart better. [...]
    Today we can generally go to a Mozart opera and find it will be
    well sung by
    young singers who
    look appropriate and
    conducted in a fashion that is suitable
    Last edited by DavidA; Today at 08:01."

    You said 'better'. 'Better' than when?
    Last edited by Revitalized Classics; Sep-29-2020 at 16:11.

  18. #43
    Senior Member DavidA's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Revitalized Classics View Post
    "The fact is we do Mozart better. [...]
    Today we can generally go to a Mozart opera and find it will be
    well sung by
    young singers who
    look appropriate and
    conducted in a fashion that is suitable
    Last edited by DavidA; Today at 08:01."

    You said 'better'. 'Better' than when?
    So where did I say what you said I said? That is the question you have not answered. Putting something in capital letters does not make you any the less wrong in your assumptions.
    Last edited by DavidA; Sep-29-2020 at 17:12.

  19. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by DavidA View Post
    So where did I say what you said I said? That is the question you have not answered. Putting something in capital letters does not make you any the less wrong in your assumptions.
    Will you explain what on Earth you are talking about? Just once.

    You repeat that modern singers are better - with no proof - and assert that they sing well, look appropriate and the conducting is suitable - as if that hasn't been happening for the entire post-war period.

    Where and when were the galumphing performances of Mozart which supposedly make contemporary performances preferable?

    We had actual stars gracing Mozart performances for the entire 1950s, 1960s, 1970s and 1980s. Where are the singers like Freni and Popp, Te Kanawa and Margaret Price, Allen, Ramey and Raimondi etc today? Just point them out...

    I could go back and take a specific Wagner cast from the past and compare it with the best we have from the present and swear we do that better today. We are talking about generalisations not specifics.
    It's not just the case that the Met's cast in 2022 might not match Solti's superb Paris cast in 1973 and 1980.

    The argument is that the Met's 2022 cast, or any contemporary cast, lack the star power to match any of the previous casts in surviving broadcasts from that house or Covent Garden or Glyndebourne etc from whenever they started taping them in the 1930s up until the 1990s. It is grim.

    If we are living through a Mozartian renaissance like you say, cite examples and explain why
    1) opera is not in the doldrums but actually
    2) your idiosyncratic view that it is actually better than what we have all come to know.
    Last edited by Revitalized Classics; Sep-29-2020 at 18:36.

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  21. #45
    Senior Member DavidA's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Revitalized Classics View Post
    Will you explain what on Earth you are talking about? Just once.

    You repeat that modern singers are better - with no proof - and assert that they sing well, look appropriate and the conducting is suitable - as if that hasn't been happening for the entire post-war period.

    Where and when were the galumphing performances of Mozart which supposedly make contemporary performances preferable?

    We had actual stars gracing Mozart performances for the entire 1950s, 1960s, 1970s and 1980s. Where are the singers like Freni and Popp, Te Kanawa and Margaret Price, Allen, Ramey and Raimondi etc today? Just point them out...



    It's not just the case that the Met's cast in 2022 might not match Solti's superb Paris cast in 1973 and 1980.

    The argument is that the Met's 2022 cast, or any contemporary cast, lack the star power to match any of the previous casts in surviving broadcasts from that house or Covent Garden or Glyndebourne etc from whenever they started taping them in the 1930s up until the 1990s. It is grim.

    If we are living through a Mozartian renaissance like you say, cite examples and explain why
    1) opera is not in the doldrums but actually
    2) your idiosyncratic view that it is actually better than what we have all come to know.
    Will you just stop saying I said words which I did not say. It is so irritating. Please read what I put and then come back with a response.

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