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Thread: The Current State of the Bulldog Games

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    Moderator Art Rock's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bulldog View Post
    Any suggestions concerning number of works in a round? Do you like 10? 20? Would you prefer a larger or smaller number?
    As a player, I think at least 10, at most 20. As a game runner, to keep things manageable, the same numbers.

    For games with many obscure compositions, I would prefer to go to the lower end of the scale, to have more time to listen to them.
    Last edited by Art Rock; May-20-2021 at 19:57.

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    Moderator Art Rock's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by allaroundmusicenthusiast View Post
    I also wonder if there's a way to open up things a bit more while voting. I know it's allowed to post links, but are we just voting for our favorites before the game or do people also listen to the works they don't know and then vote?
    For a while I experimented with a 24 hours period after posting a round before voting started - giving the players a chance to make a case for the ones they feel passionate about (linking to videos, posting information). I liked the idea (obviously or I would not have done it), but I found that only very few players used it - most of them were just waiting for the game to start. So I stopped it after a while.

    As a player, I usually know about half of the entries in a round. If a work that I don't know gathers a substantial number of points during the game, I tend to check it out. I simply do not have the time to listen to each entry.
    Last edited by Art Rock; May-20-2021 at 19:58.

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    Senior Member advokat's Avatar
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    20 with half-time adjustments are those that I enjoy most.
    Last edited by advokat; May-20-2021 at 20:59.

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    Senior Member advokat's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Art Rock View Post
    For a while I experimented with a 24 hours period after posting a round before voting started - giving the players a chance to make a case for the ones they feel passionate about (linking to videos, posting information). I liked the idea (obviously or I would not have done it), but I found that only very few players used it - most of them were just waiting for the game to start. So I stopped it after a while.

    As a player, I usually know about half of the entries in a round. If a work that I don't know gathers a substantial number of points during the game, I tend to check it out. I simply do not have the time to listen to each entry.
    I would not bother to check all the links that people might care to post. If I am interested in an unknown work, I will find it myself. I have checked out several entries that players seemed to care about most, and at least in one case ordered the piece from Amazon at once. The unknown pieces are almost all from modern works, about which I am highly suspicious, and, for me, that was a good way to explore the period.
    Last edited by advokat; May-20-2021 at 21:44.

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    Senior Member Dorsetmike's Avatar
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    Might it be an idea to limit the number of initial nominations to say 2 or 3 a day but to include a link to the work, either Youtube or other source. That way hopefully more players would have time to hear the works or a significant part thereof.I have noticed that some of the less well known works get numerous "likes" when Youtube links are posted yet when nominated in a game get few if any votes (other than my own!)
    I'm like my avatar .................. a local ruin

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    Senior Member Bulldog's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Art Rock View Post
    As a player, I think at least 10, at most 20. As a game runner, to keep things manageable, the same numbers.

    For games with many obscure compositions, I would prefer to go to the lower end of the scale, to have more time to listen to them.
    Same here.....................

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    Moderator Art Rock's Avatar
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    Since we're throwing out questions...

    Both Bulldog and I have run games where all valid nominations are in the game, but also games where a nomination had to be seconded to enter the game. Do the players have a preference?

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    Senior Member Bulldog's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Art Rock View Post
    Since we're throwing out questions...

    Both Bulldog and I have run games where all valid nominations are in the game, but also games where a nomination had to be seconded to enter the game. Do the players have a preference?
    As a player, I prefer that all valid nominations be included. It's a downer to select a work and then find that it won't even have the opportunity to compete.

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  15. #24
    Senior Member Bulldog's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by allaroundmusicenthusiast View Post
    I have no problem with the differences in scoring between games, I've made mistakes at first, but now I think I've got it -mostly- covered. Something that interested me was that in the recent Dutilleux/Ginastera/Lutoslawski/Hovhaness game the limit was 5 points and we had 13 points in total to give. That's also a good thing I find with Art Rock's games, I always have an extra 2 to give after I've already selected my two favorites. Perhaps this is only me, but with the 6-4 system, I almost always just vote for two works.

    I also wonder if there's a way to open up things a bit more while voting. I know it's allowed to post links, but are we just voting for our favorites before the game or do people also listen to the works they don't know and then vote?
    I often vote in a 6-4 pattern; I like big numbers, fast driving, and I always want to win. However, just as there are disadvantages to putting your votes all over the board, there are some also with 6-4. The primary negative is a situation where you very much like several of the works in the round; by voting for only two, you essentially throw the others under the bus. Fortunately, we have folks who display a variety of voting patterns. Getting back to the matter of winning, we have a few members who don't seem to care much about the final results; their motivations lie elsewhere. Variety is the spice of life.

    As for voters listening to all or some of the works before voting, your guess is as good as mine. Obviously, I would prefer that every voter listen to every work before voting, but that's not practical. Being a retired person, I suppose I'm in a fairly good position to listen to everything in my games, Art Rock's games, and all the works in the Science project. However, I don't have the time to do all that, so I wing it some in the Science project.

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    Senior Member Bulldog's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dorsetmike View Post
    Might it be an idea to limit the number of initial nominations to say 2 or 3 a day but to include a link to the work, either Youtube or other source. That way hopefully more players would have time to hear the works or a significant part thereof.I have noticed that some of the less well known works get numerous "likes" when Youtube links are posted yet when nominated in a game get few if any votes (other than my own!)
    My initial reaction to your suggestion is that it could take forever before the voting started; I could be dead by then. I'll give your posting another look tomorrow when I'll be ready for it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bulldog View Post
    I often vote in a 6-4 pattern; I like big numbers, fast driving, and I always want to win. However, just as there are disadvantages to putting your votes all over the board, there are some also with 6-4. The primary negative is a situation where you very much like several of the works in the round; by voting for only two, you essentially throw the others under the bus. Fortunately, we have folks who display a variety of voting patterns. Getting back to the matter of winning, we have a few members who don't seem to care much about the final results; their motivations lie elsewhere. Variety is the spice of life.
    I like the 6-4 pattern, yet sometimes I feel that there could be an incentive for the players to spread more their points in the middle/end of a round. I don't know what other members think of this, but I suggest adding a rule that allows a player to have more points per vote if they use a maximum of only 2 or 3 points per alternative.
    Last edited by Xisten267; May-20-2021 at 22:40.

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  19. #27
    Senior Member SanAntone's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Art Rock View Post
    Since we're throwing out questions...

    Both Bulldog and I have run games where all valid nominations are in the game, but also games where a nomination had to be seconded to enter the game. Do the players have a preference?
    I prefer a quicker nomination process, so if requiring a second lengthens the nomination process, I'm against it.

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  21. #28
    Senior Member SanAntone's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bulldog View Post
    I often vote in a 6-4 pattern; I like big numbers, fast driving, and I always want to win. However, just as there are disadvantages to putting your votes all over the board, there are some also with 6-4. The primary negative is a situation where you very much like several of the works in the round; by voting for only two, you essentially throw the others under the bus. Fortunately, we have folks who display a variety of voting patterns. Getting back to the matter of winning, we have a few members who don't seem to care much about the final results; their motivations lie elsewhere. Variety is the spice of life.

    As for voters listening to all or some of the works before voting, your guess is as good as mine. Obviously, I would prefer that every voter listen to every work before voting, but that's not practical. Being a retired person, I suppose I'm in a fairly good position to listen to everything in my games, Art Rock's games, and all the works in the Science project. However, I don't have the time to do all that, so I wing it some in the Science project.
    I have created YouTube playlists with all the works, or at least the works I don't know - but rarely have had enough time to listen to them. I'll listen to the first 30 seconds and if it doesn't grab me, it won't get my vote.

    Yeah, I'm a hard nut to crack.

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  23. #29
    Senior Member allaroundmusicenthusiast's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bulldog View Post
    I often vote in a 6-4 pattern; I like big numbers, fast driving, and I always want to win. However, just as there are disadvantages to putting your votes all over the board, there are some also with 6-4. The primary negative is a situation where you very much like several of the works in the round; by voting for only two, you essentially throw the others under the bus. Fortunately, we have folks who display a variety of voting patterns. Getting back to the matter of winning, we have a few members who don't seem to care much about the final results; their motivations lie elsewhere. Variety is the spice of life.

    As for voters listening to all or some of the works before voting, your guess is as good as mine. Obviously, I would prefer that every voter listen to every work before voting, but that's not practical. Being a retired person, I suppose I'm in a fairly good position to listen to everything in my games, Art Rock's games, and all the works in the Science project. However, I don't have the time to do all that, so I wing it some in the Science project.
    What is the Science project?

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    Moderator Nereffid's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by allaroundmusicenthusiast View Post
    What is the Science project?
    The ongoing "Favorite and Most Recommended Works" list, run by "science".
    Last edited by Nereffid; May-20-2021 at 23:04.

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