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Thread: Antal Dorati Recordings

  1. #16
    Senior Member Knorf's Avatar
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    I'm a avowed fan of Doráti's recorded legacy, especially his legendary LSO Firebird, Dvořák symphonies of which the LSO Seventh might be my all-time favorite, and his Schönberg/Berg/Webern album, with possibly a best-ever recording of Schönberg's Fünf Orchesterstücke, Op. 16.

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  3. #17
    Junior Member Endeavour's Avatar
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    So many great ones...I'll give a special shout out to this one:
    Mercury Living Presence Vol 3 - 6 - Rimsky-Korsakov - Dorati.jpg

    And his ever impressive Haydn symphony cycle.
    Haydn - Symphonies - Dorati.jpg

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    Senior Member joen_cph's Avatar
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    Besides the 20t century stuff already mentioned, Liszt Christus Oratorium on Hungaroton.

    I'm less of a fan of his Kodaly/Decca, though. For example, there are more engaged and better-sounding versions of the Hary Janos Suite.

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    Great posts, folks. Most everything that I would have mentioned has already been covered--especially Dorati's excellent Bartok & Stravinsky, so there's not much point in my posting.

    I don't mean to be a downer but, in my view, Dorati's Haydn Symphonies have been surpassed in the decades since he recorded his cycle--by the likes of Sir Colin Davis, Leonard Bernstein, Adam Fischer, (& maybe Leonard Slatkin & Thomas Fey? whose Haydn gets very well reviewed, but I've not heard it myself); as well as by a multitude of period conductors, who have had the considerable advantage of a more up to date scholarly understanding of the performance practices, instruments, & expectations of Haydn's day--especially Frans Bruggen, Giovanni Antonini, & Christopher Hogwood (but also arguably Sigiswald Kuijken, Nikolaus Harnoncourt, Ton Koopman, Trevor Pinnock, Manfred Huss, & Nicholas McGegan...). However, Dorati is still the only conductor to tackle Haydn's operas extensively--with the Orchestre de Chambre Lausanne, for Philips. Surprisingly, no conductor in more recent times has wanted to do a complete series of them, as far as I'm aware. So, from that standpoint, Dorati's 20 CDs covering all of Haydn's opera output (or nearly so?) remains an invaluable survey for Haydn buffs!: https://www.amazon.com/Haydn-Operas-.../dp/B002EPLGWU.

    (By the way, I should also mention that Mrs. Antal Dorati, pianist Ilse von Alpenheim recorded an excellent survey of Haydn's Complete Piano Sonatas back in the 1970s, as well--which I would like to see come back into print: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BOP73W82O2Q)
    Last edited by Josquin13; Sep-16-2021 at 23:00.

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  9. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by joen_cph View Post
    Besides the 20t century stuff already mentioned, Liszt Christus Oratorium on Hungaroton.
    O, was it Dorati who conducted that?! [Takes it down from the shelves and looks.] So it was. Brilliant, brilliant recording.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rmathuln View Post
    Both Nutcracker recordings.

    The Mercury is one of the very best sounding and has a fabulous Serenade for Strings recording too. I have the SACD version, which is long OOP and mucho expensivo when available. A Complete Dorati Mercury box will surface with Tom Fine supervised remasters. It may be best to wait for that.



    The Philips Concertgebouw recording, which has had numerous CD versions over the years, is special because of the orchestra and venue. There is a sumptuous quality to the Philips set that makes it a must have, for me at least.

    The original LP cover:



    The most recent remaster:



    Wilma Cozart Fine refused to participate in the SACD reissues of the Mercury Catalog, viewing the whole technology as a gimmick. I own 2 of the Paray/Detroit SACDs and actthink they are great sounding

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  13. #22
    Senior Member jegreenwood's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Triplets View Post
    Wilma Cozart Fine refused to participate in the SACD reissues of the Mercury Catalog, viewing the whole technology as a gimmick. I own 2 of the Paray/Detroit SACDs and actthink they are great sounding
    I, too, own several, including Nutcracker and Firebird and like them a lot.

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  15. #23
    Senior Member Kiki's Avatar
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    Dorati's Le Sacre du printemps on both Mercury and Decca are great accounts.

    The Minneapolis account is full of overflowing raw power. It is truly phenomenal. The edgy, squeaky Mercury Living Presence sound may have also contributed to it (in a positive way, perhaps surprisingly). In fact I am not troubled by the dry, rough, dated sound. I am more troubled by the fake soundstage and unnatural highlighting created by Mercury.

    On the other hand, his Detroit remake is more refined, less wayward and much slower, but arguably it also hits harder. Decca back in 1981 still produced great recordings, which definitely helps. The wiggling grooves on the LP are also quite a sight.

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    [QUOTE=Rmathuln;2139283][FONT=Arial Black][SIZE=4][COLOR="#800000"]Both Nutcracker recordings.

    A Complete Dorati Mercury box will surface with Tom Fine supervised remasters. It may be best to wait for that.

    Is this speculation on your part or do you know something that hasn't been announced? I would love for this to happen if for no other reason than to save me the the trouble of tracking down lots of expensive OOP and/or hard-to-find items.

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    It’s also worth remembering that Choral Music on Record listed “Dorati’s exciting evocation of the gargantuan 1784 Westminster Abbey Commemoration performance” as one of the five recordings that “a core collection of Messiahs should include.”

    Handel-Messiah-Dorati.jpg

    “A sensitive recreation of the spirit, if not the letter, of the 1784 Westminster Abbey Commemoration Messiah.... The vast reverberance of the National Cathedral, Washington, DC, is not unlike that of Westminster Abbey, and the performance, under the direction of Antal Dorati, crackles with charisma and excitement.... A particularly fine solo quartet—soprano Edith Mathis, counter-tenor James Bowman, tenor Claes Ahnsjö, and bass Tom Krause—sang the solos.... The Westminster Abbey Commemoration version has been duplicated as exactly as possible in the Dorati recording” (Teri Noel Towe in Choral Music on Record, pp. 78, 100).

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    [QUOTE=jimsumner;2140056]
    Quote Originally Posted by Rmathuln View Post
    [FONT=Arial Black][SIZE=4][COLOR="#800000"]Both Nutcracker recordings.

    A Complete Dorati Mercury box will surface with Tom Fine supervised remasters. It may be best to wait for that.

    Is this speculation on your part or do you know something that hasn't been announced? I would love for this to happen if for no other reason than to save me the the trouble of tracking down lots of expensive OOP and/or hard-to-find items.
    I heard Tom Fine himself says so, first with the Kubelik recordings that are already available, and then he specifically mentioned that Dorati's Mercury legacy would follow, including many mono recording not previously released officially on CD by Mercury/UMG.

    Eventually the entire catalog will be done.

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  22. #27
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    [QUOTE=Rmathuln;2140177]
    Quote Originally Posted by jimsumner View Post
    I heard Tom Fine himself says so, first with the Kubelik recordings that are already available, and then he specifically mentioned that Dorati's Mercury legacy would follow, including many mono recording not previously released officially on CD by Mercury/UMG.

    Eventually the entire catalog will be done.
    I have 2 of the three large Mercury boxes that were were released a few years ago, which I believe have the bulk of the Mercury Dorati recordings.I was going to comment that I don’t think any further remasterings are required, but then I remembered that I bought a Paray set of the Mercury recordings from a Japanese reissue company that are a distinct improvement over the Mercury set, so why not?
    I lived in Detroit when Dorati took that post and I seem to remember hearing a Firebird recording that was more exciting than the recording that was issued.

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    [QUOTE=Rmathuln;2140177]
    Quote Originally Posted by jimsumner View Post
    I heard Tom Fine himself says so, first with the Kubelik recordings that are already available, and then he specifically mentioned that Dorati's Mercury legacy would follow, including many mono recording not previously released officially on CD by Mercury/UMG.

    Eventually the entire catalog will be done.
    Excellent news. I've been holding off getting some affordable Dorati downloads in hopes that something like this was coming down the pipes. Many thanks.
    Last edited by jimsumner; Sep-19-2021 at 04:41.

  24. #29
    Senior Member pianozach's Avatar
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    I grew up with this one. Love it to death.





    As it turns out, Dorati subsequently RErecorded it in STEREO, but THAT was released with an album cover that was almost identical to the first release.
    Last edited by pianozach; Sep-19-2021 at 19:27.

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    I've always found the Mercury recordings of Dorati/Minneapolis, Paray/Detroit to be somewhat thin and scrawny sounding...just not enough heft in the brass and lower woodwinds especially....I thought it might be Mercury's recording, but I don't think that holds up - their recordings with Dorati/LSO, Fennell/EastmanWE and Kubelik/Chicago do not suffer from that sonic anemia at all...they sound terrific, overall....
    Perhaps it was the recording venues?? or perhaps they simply didn't have the musicians who could put the sound out?? Long. long ago, I heard Paray/Detroit perform Sibelius #2 live in a local theater...it sounded fine [I was in HS at the time].....but I remember how much more sonorous the Ormandy/Phila was when I heard them play the same work live a couple of years later..
    but, that was many moons ago, and audio memory is notoriously short-lived.....

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