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Maybe it's an idea to keep the length of the music down so we don't overwhelm the people new to classical music. It's too easy to be eager about all the music we love. The last 2 years I've taught music history in high school so I have some ideas on the topic. I thought it was very hard to pick the right pieces to use for learning more about listening skills and music theory. Next year we'll have a new curriculum, so I have to plan it all even better. Then I'll have to include world and folk music! Like if classical music isn't vast enough. After my 1st year I made a little poll based on a playlist of 33 pieces. The class favorite composers were Bach, Haydn, Beethoven, Schumann and Grieg.
 

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From the OP: "Often people unfamiliar with Classical music will ask advice on how to approach it. Where do you start?"

I am curious as to how widespread this phenomenon is--the unsolicited(?) asking of advice about CM? Any testimony from other members? Also it would be useful to know something of the pre-existing musical tastes of the seeking individual so that one could be aware of any patterns that might suggest better what pieces to select. And surely the age--very important--of the seeker. Addressing a general audience of people who show up to hear a speaker explain CM to them will require a whole different approach from the tailored personal approach. Ditto for a college class taken to fulfill a requirement. In Geology teaching, there are "Rocks for Jocks" courses for such. Never having taught music or music appreciation, I could only offer in retrospect what I heard in my childhood and adolescence, and, from that, speculate now on what a suitable general-purpose syllabus might consist of. But I certainly like the idea of using already-existing cultural usages and references as a starting-point. Judge Judy on the Tube surely pays out massive royalties to Beethoven for her use of the opening notes of his Fifth Symphony for her show. ;)
 

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Discussion Starter · #24 · (Edited)
From the OP: "Often people unfamiliar with Classical music will ask advice on how to approach it. Where do you start?"

1. This phenomenon is not "widespread", at least not in terms of being asked whether I'd prefer "Paper or Plastic?" at the grocery store. But it happens frequently enough to inspire me to create this list.

2. I am curious as to how widespread this phenomenon is--the unsolicited(?) asking of advice about CM? Any testimony from other members? Also it would be useful to know something of the pre-existing musical tastes of the seeking individual so that one could be aware of any patterns that might suggest better what pieces to select. And surely the age--very important--of the seeker. Addressing a general audience of people who show up to hear a speaker explain CM to them will require a whole different approach from the tailored personal approach. Ditto for a college class taken to fulfill a requirement. In Geology teaching, there are "Rocks for Jocks" courses for such. Never having taught music or music appreciation, I could only offer in retrospect what I heard in my childhood and adolescence, and, from that, speculate now on what a suitable general-purpose syllabus might consist of. But I certainly like the idea of using already-existing cultural usages and references as a starting-point. Judge Judy on the Tube surely pays out massive royalties to Beethoven for her use of the opening notes of his Fifth Symphony for her show. ;)
Well, I'm taking a one-size-fits-all approach. I'm afraid that making different lists for different potential demographics may simply be one subcategory too far.

For instance, further on down my list there's some more modern atonal and electronic works, and they most certainly won't be to everyone's taste. I cannot make a list for kids, a list for teens, a list for Metalheads, a list for jazz-lovers, etc.

There are some longstanding members here that really prefer edgier works such as these, but providing an on-ramp using more accessible works tends to garner more fans.

THAT is why Classic fM radio plays so much John Williams, shorter works, and old chestnuts (I just went to their current playlist and there's the Gymnopedie No.3, Beethoven's 1st Symphony, William Tell Overture, some James Horner, etc. They DO play rare works and experimental stuff, but those are somewhat infrequent and certainly spread out over the day). They play these because people enjoy them. They shy away from John Cage and Stockhausen during the day because they don't want people closing the browser page, or changing the dial.

When they stick to shorter pieces, and someone in their audience doesn't like it, they know it won't be long before something else comes up.

3. There are a few new members that are looking precisely for something like this, and there may be more in the future. If they comment, then they'll see the thread pop up in the "New Posts" with a little green dot on it, making it easier to spot.

4. I am so damned sure that I'll get some things wrong, or leave details out. I have no doubt there will be corrections offered by the esteemed membership here :p

There will also be educated and experienced folks that will roll their eyes at the inclusion of one entry or another. You just can't please 'em all.

5. Beethoven's Symphony No. 5 is #16 on my list. It really IS an iconic work, whether you are tired of it or not. Perfect entry-level Classical.

6. Carnival of the Animals DID make the list, but it's far down. It's fun, but really is geared for children. Same with Tubby the Tuba, although it's not in my Top 500. Or Top 600. Yeah, I've got The Nutcracker on the list somewhere. I think.
 

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Discussion Starter · #25 ·
Maybe it's an idea to keep the length of the music down so we don't overwhelm the people new to classical music. It's too easy to be eager about all the music we love. The last 2 years I've taught music history in high school so I have some ideas on the topic. I thought it was very hard to pick the right pieces to use for learning more about listening skills and music theory. Next year we'll have a new curriculum, so I have to plan it all even better. Then I'll have to include world and folk music! Like if classical music isn't vast enough. After my 1st year I made a little poll based on a playlist of 33 pieces. The class favorite composers were Bach, Haydn, Beethoven, Schumann and Grieg.
I'm in agreement here, although some of Classical Music's greatest achievements are the expansive epic works we all know and love.

I've tried to strike a balance.

But what do you do with WTC, or The Four Seasons? Or Chopin's Preludes? The Sonata and Symphony forms generally dictate multi-movement pieces. Sure Beethoven's 1st movement of the 9th Symphony could be listened to as a stand-alone piece, but we know he quotes it in the 4th movement, which ties ALL of the movements together.

You're going to love #4!
 

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just as a suggestion - one of the things which intimidated me from moving from popular music to classical was that popular music is frequently an album-based form, while classical very much isn't. i really think one of the best ways to not intimidate people is to focus on specific recordings, rather than just suggesting specific works (it's easy to find "greatest classical works" lists but shockingly hard to find any good "classic recordings" lists which don't focus on a specific composer or work).

anyway, some really standard but great works (mostly off the top of my head, so composers I don't listen to much, notably Brahms and Mozart aren't represented) in a recording-based form. Sticking mostly with performers who perform what you might call the "20th century standard" style of performing since that's what people tend to like as a baseline before branching out. (i might also add "when in doubt, go with Szell/Cleveland when looking for a "standard" version of a work)

I believe all these are on Spotify. also i don't listen to Baroque music much (and I think the otherwise standard Gould "Goldbergs" album might not be the most accessible thing for beginners) so suggestions there would be welcome



Classical/early Romantic:

Maurizio Pollini - The Late Beethoven Sonatas
Maurizio Pollini - Beethoven Piano Sonatas No. 13/14/15
Leonard Bernstein - Haydn Symphony No. 82 "The Bear" / Haydn Symphony No. 83 "The Hen"
Charles Munch - Schubert Symphonies No. 8 "Unfinished" / No. 9 "The Great"
Carlos Kleiber - Beethoven Symphonies No. 5/7
Gunter Wand - Beethoven Symphony No. 9 (the Wand box set is cheap and extremely good if someone wants a "standard" and consistently played Beethoven symphony box to start with too)

Romantic:

Colin Davis - Hector Berlioz - Symphonie Fantastique (the royal concertgebouw version)
Szymanowski/Myrthes - Cesar Franck - Sonata for Violin and Piano
Paul Paray - Camille Saint-Saens - Symphony No. 3 "Organ"
Jean Martinon - Claude Debussy - La Mer
Pierre Monteux - Maurice Ravel - Daphnis et Chloe
Leonard Bernstein - Anton Dvorak - Symphony No. 9 "From The New World"

Post-Romantic:
Adrian Boult - Gustav Holst - The Planets (any version but the Vienna one)
Leonard Bernstein - Igor Stravinsky - The Rite of Spring
George Szell - Bela Bartok - Concerto for Orchestra
Leonard Bernstein - Aaron Copland - Appalachian Spring/Rodeo
Arthur Fiedler/Earl Wild - George Gershwin - Rhapsody in Blue/Concerto in F/An American in Paris
 

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Agreed with the above regarding the appeal of album recommendations.

A shortlist:

Vivaldi, Four Seasons - Marriner

Beethoven, Symphony No. 9/Egmont overture - Fricsay

Mozart, Piano concertos Nos. 20, 23, 24, 27 - Curzon

Bach, Cello suites - Fournier

Tchaikovsky, 1812 overture - Dorati

Beethoven, Piano sonatas Nos. 8/14/23 - Rubinstein

Brahms, Violin concerto - Perlman/Giulini

Monteverdi, Vespers of 1610 - Gardiner

Debussy/Ravel, String Quartets - Melos Quartet

Chopin, “Selections from the Chopin collection” - Rubinstein

Stravinsky, Rite of spring/Petrushka - Dorati/Detroit SO

Rachmaninoff, Piano concertos Nos. 2 & 3 - Janis/Dorati

Mozart, Requiem - Marriner

Gershwin, Rhapsody in blue/An American in Paris - Bernstein/NYPO

Puccini, Tosca - Callas/De Sabata

Schumann, Dichterliebe/Schubert, Lieder - Wunderlich

Wagner, Overtures & Preludes - Karajan (EMI)

.
 

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After only one entry I'm surprised that no one yet mentioned Mussorgsky's "Pictures at an Exhibition".

Mr. M would've been a rock & roller had he lived in this era, and Pictures is, perhaps, the closest thing in the classical world to rock, and since most people are fully acquainted with rock, it makes sense to recommend it as a starting point.

But as it is, it's relegated to spot #13 (so . . .still in the Top 20), as there are some other heavyweights that pushed him out of the Top 10. Given the volume of really accessible "Great" classical works, that's actually pretty damned good.
Pictures by Mussorgsky and Ravel was only my second entry into my music collection which I bought on LP when I was about 14 back in about 1982. My first classical recordings was Tchaikovsky's 1812 (big surprise!) in an album that also included Tchaikovsky's March Slav and Romeo and Juliet Overture-Fantasy; a CBS reissue of Leonard Bernstein with the NYPO. Pictures followed, also by Bernstein/NYPO, though I actually purchased it for Night on Bald Mountain.

Apart from Bernstein's I now have many other renditions of Pictures by Mussorgsky and Ravel including Ormandy/Philadelphia, Toscanini/NBC, and Karajan/Berlin. I've also got the Mussorgsky/Stokowski transcription by Jose Serebier on NAXOS; which lacks Ravel's orchestral color and smoothness, but attempts to be more urgent and raw. Stokowski said he wated to take the "French" out of what Ravel did to Pictures. I even like Isao Tomita's electronic Pictures which I've only heard on YouTube. I still have Vladimir Horowitz on CD playing the original piano score which is fine, but at one time I had Stanislav Richter on cassette in a live recording from Bulgaria where he really bangs it out.

Newspaper Font Publication News Rectangle


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Discussion Starter · #31 · (Edited)
#4
The Firebird
Igor Stravinsky
1910


This ballet has historic significance not only as Stravinsky's breakthrough piece, but also as the beginning of the collaboration between Diaghilev and Stravinsky that would also produce the acclaimed ballets Petrushka (1911) and The Rite of Spring (1913).

It was somewhat surprisingly very well received at the time, with one reviewer writing "The old-gold vermiculation of the fantastic back-cloth seems to have been invented to a formula identical with that of the shimmering web of the orchestra".

Stravinsky used several ideas from works by Rimsky-Korsakov in his score.

Stravinsky was only 28 years old when he composed this innovative work, and was his first ballet score.

"Music is given to us with the sole purpose of establishing an order in things, including, and particularly, the coordination between man and time."-Igor Stravinsky

Here is Stravinsky conducting The Firebird in 1959. Perhaps not the best-sounding version, but hey, he is the "original artist".

Stravinsky Conducts The Firebird Suite, Japan 1959


:angel:

Progressive Rock band Yes has regularly used the ballet's Finale as their "walk-on" music for concerts since 1971.
 

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Discussion Starter · #32 ·
#5
1812 Festival Overture, Op. 49
Pyotr Ilyich Tchaikovsky
1882


When I was growing up, this was perhaps my all-time favorite Classical work. The rousing brass fanfares, the volley of cannon fire, the ringing chimes . . . Way to go, Tchaikovsy!

Not that most people really care, but it's actual title is The Year 1812 Solemn Overture, festival overture in E♭ major, Op. 49, and was written to commemorate the successful Russian defense against Napoleon's invading Grande Armée in 1812 at the Battle of Borodino, during the French invasion of Russia.

In this respect it shares a link with Beethoven's Eroica Symphony, which was originally dedicated to Napoleon, a dedication he withdrew after Napoleon proclaimed himself Emperor.

So, why is it played every 4th of July in the USA? You can trace that back to Arthur Fielder leading the Boston Pops through the piece in 1974, during a televised 4 July concert, which elevated the 1812 Overture to full-on national anthem status.

Of course, my favorite version is the one I grew up with, with Antal Dorati conducting the Minneapolis Symphony Orchestra in 1958. They found the "perfect" cannon shot (using a cannon at Westpoint), and overdubbed it onto the studio recording. Same with the bells. But, again, Classical works seem to be so much more enjoyable in a live context, and there are several on YouTube from which to choose.


There's a sumptuous version by the Hong Kong Festival Orchestra with a supplemental vocal chorus of 100 voices. Instead of cannons they use what they refer to as "live explosions using concussion technology". Ah, the Chinese and explosives go back for centuries.

There's another by the Het Koninklijk Concertgebouw Orkest that uses an rack with a score of actual bells, and rifle-firing soldiers in period costumes.

Other versions use recorded bells, timpani or large bass drums, military brass bands in the balconies. One actually has rows of cannons lined up OUTSIDE the concert hall firing in perfect synchronization.

And then there's the 2013 version at the Hollywood Bowl with synchronized fireworks.

As they're all live, they all have varying sound qualities, and it's certainly difficult to choose.

But here's the Banda Simfonica d'Algemes performing outdoors, with explosives from a balcony in the square, and real tower bells operated by bell ringers pulling the ropes to make them swing. There's a high number of very young musicians in the orchestra, and is not the original orchestration, as you can tell by the inclusion of saxophones.


.

The impact of the 1812 Overture cannot be diminished. It's been used in film, television, and advertising.

And in popular music . . . . Here's the Swingle Singers

 

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Discussion Starter · #33 · (Edited)
#6
The Four Seasons
Antonio Vivaldi
1723


The Four Seasons is an extended work of four three movement violin concerti, and as many here have suggested, I decided to choose just one of the suites, Summer, although I highly recommend the whole damn thing. Still, in choosing just one of the Seasons, it's still a 3-movement piece lasting 10 minutes. In my opinion, the Summer concerto is likely the least popular of the four. It seems that the other three are better known. I just think that Summer is the most 'sophisticated' of the bunch. It has short little introspective sections, some wild variations in dynamics

AND . . . They were written around 1716-1717 and published in 1725 in Amsterdam, together with eight additional concerti, as Il cimento dell'armonia e dell'inventione (The Contest Between Harmony and Invention).

So . . . one could make a case for Vivaldi's Four Seasons being the best musical piece of all time. And "best" is a very subjective term. But The Four Seasons is a great example of what it is, a group of four Baroque violin concerti. And it's a beautiful piece that has stood for centuries, beloved and revered by millions. Sure, it's not as complex as Bach, but so what?

Anyway, it's certainly a tough call to single out the best of the bunch as far as accessibility.

But I went with the 2nd concerto, Summer, or more precisely . . .

Concerto No. 2 in G minor, Op. 8, RV 315, "Summer" (L'estate)
I. Allegro non molto
II. Adagio e piano - Presto e forte
III. Presto

It has an unusually slow start, and creeps up on you. Before you know it the oppressive summer heat has turned into a tempest (in a Heavy Metal kind of way), then, just as suddenly, switches back.

Here's Julia Fischer and Symphonieorchester des Bayerischen Rundfunks (Bavarian Radio Symphony Chamber Orchestra)

Note that with the exception of the cellists and continuo (keyboard) player [in the back], they are all standing.


:clap:​

This video is nice because Ms. Fischer gives you an encore of Niccolò Paganini's Caprice No. 2 (from 24 Caprices for Solo Violin, written between 1802 and 1817) at the end. These are designed as études, with each Caprice exploring different skills; the 2nd Caprice focuses on detache with many string crossings across non-adjacent strings - watch for it! Oh, and Paganini was the most celebrated violinist of his time.

:clap:​

So, naturally, Summer is just a portion of an intensely wonderful epic work, but it's best to just get your feet wet first, and see how it goes. I've got the entire 42 minute Suite on the list a bit later (at #29).
 

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Discussion Starter · #34 · (Edited)
#7
Brandenburg Concerto No. 6 in B flat, BWV 1051
("Concerto #6 due Viole da Braccio, due Viole da Gamba, Violoncello, Violone e Cembalo")
Johann Sebastian Bach
1721


It's an excellent example of Bach's mastery of polyphony. The entire collection is widely regarded as some of the best orchestral compositions of the Baroque era.

The six "Brandenburg Concertos", no two of which sound alike, encompass an impressive range of style and topic, and manifest in combination the courtly elegance of the French suite, the exuberance of the Italian solo concerto and the gravity of German counterpoint. Subtle and brilliant at the same time, they are a microcosm of Baroque music, with an astonishingly vast sample of that era's emotional universe.

There is an interesting story behind the music's survival: The manuscript was nearly lost in World War II, when being transported for safekeeping to Prussia by train in the care of a librarian. The train came under aerial bombardment, and the librarian escaped the train, and the bombardment, in a nearby forest, with the scores hidden under his coat.

Anyway, ALL of these concertos are great, each in their own way. Personally, if I were to pick just ONE movement, it would be tough, but I'd go with the 3rd movement of the 2nd Concerto, with its piccolo trumpet solo bits (in this video the trumpet part is evidently played by George Washington) . . .

Brandenburg Concerto 2, 3rd movement, Mozart Orchestra Bologna


.

. . . followed very closely by the 1st movement of the 4th Concerto, dominated by a pair of recorders.

Brandenburg Concerto no. 4,

., APOLLO'S FIRE - The Cleveland Baroque Orchestra

.

An awful lot of folks tend to give Bach's 5th Brandenburg a lot of praise, so here's the 1st movement of that one.

Brandenburg Concerto, No. 5, 1st mvt., Apollo's Fire Baroque Orchestra, with Jeannette Sorrell, Music Director, on harpsichord.


.

But when we're talking about 15-20 minutes of an entire piece, the 6th (probably the one written first, by the way) is remarkable for several reasons.

For starters there are no violins, just two violas, two violas da gamba, a cello, and the violone, which is near the cello range but from the gamba family. And a harpsichord.

16 minutes of joy.

Bach: Brandenburg Concerto No. 6 in B flat major, BWV 1051 (Freiburger Barockorchester)

00:13 I. Allegro
05:40 II. Adagio ma non tanto
10:07 III. Allegro


.

I especially love when Bach is played on period instruments. Really puts it over the top for me.

Bach was able to create great variety in the confines of "acceptable" music [of the day] with the now-almost-obsolete instruments available to him.

I'm a avid fan of Bach's works, and used to compete with the keyboard works (inventions, preludes & fugues, etc.). His music is unequaled in our history - NO ONE writes like he did . . .
 

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Discussion Starter · #35 · (Edited)
#8
Symphony 41 in C "Jupiter", K. 551.
Wolfgang Amadeus Mozart
1788


The name of the symphony, as the story goes, is that impresario Johann Peter Salomon called it Jupiter because the opening chords of trumpet and drum flourishes, which reminded him of the god Jupiter and his thunderbolts.

The Jupiter is the third of a trio of symphonies Mozart wrote.

It's the final movement that stands out as one of the most interesting symphonic movements written by any composer. It begins with a very simple four note theme that could have been taken from a church work. What follows is a strict sonata form, but with so much use of fugal imitation that early 19th century German musicians referred to the entire work as the "symphony with the fugal finale." The movement has also been described as Mozart's most "learned" piece of music, in that it could easily serve as a textbook of fugal devices. In the final coda, all five major thematic elements are played simultaneously, yet the overall effect is not a lesson in counterpoint, but a fitting conclusion to a dramatic symphonic movement.

So here's Russian-Finnish Dima Slobodeniouk conducting the Sinfonica de Galicia from Spain. Neither the conductor nor the symphony is very well known, but this live version has both production quality, musicality, and clarity.

I. Allegro vivace (0:17 )
II. Andante cantabile (12:10 )
III. Menuetto. Allegretto (22:31 )
IV. Molto allegro (27:48 )

W.A. Mozart: Symphony nº 41 "Jupiter" - Dima Slobodeniouk - Sinfónica de Galicia

 

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Discussion Starter · #36 ·
#9
In the Steppes of Central Asia
Alexander Borodin
1880.


When Alexander II of Russia held his Silver Jubilee, in 1880, among other things he commissioned Borodin to compose a symphonic poem. It was intended to be the soundtrack to a tableau vivant - a slightly curious and now largely forgotten art form in which actors pose, motionless, in a set, often lit to resemble a painting.

The music, as well as being crammed full of great tunes, is beautifully comprehensible: the listener can easily hear the Russian troops and Central Asians travelling across the steppe. Both have their own melodies, which briefly meet, working perfectly over each other, before the Asian music wafts off into the distance and the Russian theme is left alone.

The composer provided the following description in a note to the score:

"In the desert of Central Asia the melody of a peaceful Russian song is heard at first. The approaching tramp of horses and camels is heard, together with the doleful sounds of an oriental melody. A native caravan guarded by Russian soldiers crosses the boundless steppe. It completes its long journey trustingly and without fear under the protection of the victors' awesome military strength. The caravan moves further and further away. The peaceful melodies of both vanquished and vanquisher merge into a single common harmony, whose echoes long resound in the steppe before eventually dying away in the distance"

Alexander Borodin: In the Steppes of Central Asia
Main Line Symphony Orchestra, Don Liuzzi

 

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Discussion Starter · #37 · (Edited)
#10
Overture from The Marriage of Figaro
Wolfgang Amadeus Mozart
1786


Mozart composed this 4 act comic opera The Marriage of Figaro (Le nozze di Figaro) in 1786.

Mozart famously composed the overture just a few hours before the opera's premiere. You'll recognize it.

So here's two versions from which you can choose.

First, the brilliant Leonard Bernstein conducting the extraordinary New York Philharmonic Orchestra.

And then the well-known and well respected James Levine leading a staged production of the Overture.

MOZART Le nozze di Figaro (Overture) LEONARD BERNSTEIN


Le Nozze di Figaro: Overture -- James Levine

 

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Discussion Starter · #40 · (Edited)
I'll share when pianozach's done.
LOL.

I may never be "done".

But I'd like to reiterate the gist of all this. I'm not 'ranking' these works: If I've got Holst's Planets at #1 and Mozart's Overture from The Marriage of Figaro at #10, there is NO WAY I am inferring that one is "better" or more "popular" than the other.

But if someone wants to delve into "Classical Music" for the first time, from what ever diverse background they are from, I think that my list, at least up to #25, are a great primer.

1-10
Holst - The Planets, Op. 32. 1918
Dvorak - Symphony No.9 in E minor "From the New World", Op 95. 1893
Beethoven - Symphony No. 3 "Eroica"
Stravinsky - The Firebird. 1910
Tchaikovsky - 1812 Festival Overture, Op. 49. 1882

Vivaldi - Summer, The Four Seasons. 1723
JS Bach - Brandenburg Concerto #6, In B Flat, BWV 1051. 1721.
WA Mozart - Symphony 41 in C "Jupiter", K. 551. 1788
Borodin - In the Steppes of Central Asia. 1880.
WA Mozart - Overture from The Marriage of Figaro. 1786

What . . . what do all of these have in common, other than there's someone around here that thinks these are all old and moldy, overplayed, or overrated?

They're all hummmmmable. :clap:

:tiphat:

It's time to break it up a little. Here's some Paganini played while hula-hooping.

"Paganini 24 Hula Hoop (with Hilary Hahn)"


:p

I find this especially amusing as I know someone that used to play trombone while hula hooping, which is more impressive as the slide is larger than a bow.
 
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