[norman bates]

But those definitions aren't just a definition of the range of the singer? I mean Mariah Carey is the complete opposite of what I like in a singer but what's the problem in defining her range? That does not have anything to do with her quality as a singer.

 

[norman bates]

I think you missed the point and that was I have no problem with defining the range of a singer. However, I don't like when people give operatic classifications such as "Assoluta" or "Spinto" or even "Dramatic" to a singer that has never received the adequate amount of training to don such titles. It's quite simple actually. You wouldn't want someone to have the title of Colonel when they weren't even in the Army or Navy, so why would I, a classical artist want a Pop Singer to get a title that I technically have to work my butt off for?

this is what wiki says about the "soprano assoluta" :
"Soprano sfogato ("Vented" soprano) is a term which, in the art of singing, designates a contralto or mezzo-soprano who is capable-by sheer industry or natural talent-of extending their upper range and being able to encompass the coloratura soprano tessitura. It is sometimes called soprano assoluta."

I find those videos ridiculous, because I don't think that a singer should be judged just by technical abilities (as I don't think that an actor/actress should be judged for his or her beauty), but reading this it seems that even that "assoluta" is just a definition of range.
"Coloratura" for what I know is just a definition of the agility of the soprano in singing fast passages, so it does not have anything to do with being trained or not.
I've heard trained singers with terrible voices and untrained singers who are able to do virtuosistic passages.
So my "problem" with those videos is the idea that the value of a singer has to be found in their ability to hit high notes or do fast melismatic passages and stuff like that.
I mean, Maria Bethania has probably the range of a contralto and I've never heard her doing any virtuosistic thing, but she is incredibly better in my opinon than those sopranos (assoluta or not) like Mariah Carey or Whitney Houston.

 

[norman bates]

I have a thread about the Assoluta and how it only should be referred to OPERATIC artists. Here's that link and maybe you can you can see for yourself the description of that type of voice in Opera. http://www.talkclassical.com/44122-soprano-assoluta-its-place-5.html

I see that you disagree with the definition of Whitney Houston as soprano assoluta and I don't have anything to say about it, onestly I don't even care. Maybe you're right.
But I've read the first post with your description and still I don't get why it should be something to be used only for operatic singers. Range, agility, sound, power does not have anything to do with the genre. I have the impression that what disturbs you is to put pop singers and operatic singers on the same level, and onestly I think that Maria Callas is one of the greatest singers ever but hey, I would say the same for Dock Boggs or Iris DeMent for completely different reasons, and I suspect you will not agree on that.

 

[norman bates]

You obviously missed the entire point. I'm targeting people who are using operatic classifications (example: Spinto, Dramatic, Lyric, Lyric-Dramatic, Lyric-Spinto, Ful Lyric, Assoluta, Falcon, Dugazon, Basso cantate, Basso Cantabile.) to describe the voices of non-trained singers aka Pop Singers. What is there to not understand?

What I don't understand is why those terms should not be used for you.
This is what you said:

Here's a few characteristics of the assoluta/Soprano Sfogato voice:

It possesses a dark timbre with a rich and strong low register, as well as the high notes of a soprano and occasionally a coloratura soprano.
Those voices are typically strong, dramatic and agile, supported by an excellent bel canto technique and an ability to sing in the soprano tessitura as well as in the contralto tessitura with great ease.
The common requirements for the roles associated with this voice type are:

widely varied tessitura throughout the role, extended segments lying well into the low mezzo or contralto tessitura and segments lying in high soprano tessitura
a range extending down to at least low B and at least up to high B with at least one whole tone required at either end
fioratura (coloratura) singing in the most intricate bel canto style
florid singing combined with heroic weight
a heavy or dense sound in the lower range
vocal power over energetic orchestral accompaniment.

I can't understand why you think that all those aspects can't be found also in a pop singer. For instance, recently I've seen this video:

She's singing the famous Doll song that it's considered something for a coloratura soprano AND after that a pop tune... just to say that (besides any other consideration) a style does not define the voice of a singer but it's just that, a style.

And let me ask you this: do you think that a great pop singer can be as great as a operatic singer?