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Please discuss the thread topic. Please do not chide or make negative comments about other members. If you have a problem with posts, please report them rather than posting moderator type comments.
 

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That is a statement about Parsifal, not about the whole of Wagner's ideas on Jews.
The net result is that it's a statement about Wagner's ideas on religion.

To equate Wagner's criticisms of a religion, and particularly those suggested by (but not explicitly stated in) an opera, with "Hitler's attitudes toward the Jewish problem" is indeed idiotic...
I disagree. As I've already explained, Wagner's "anti-Judaic" version of Christianity is essentially anti-semitic, and is included as a sub-category under the definition of antisemitism.

This religious form of antisemitism was pervasive in Germany (the flawed Germanic cultural matrix), and enabled Hitler in his quest.

I don't think that's idiotic, and I'm sure many readers would agree with me.
 
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Richard Wagner ( 22 May 1813 - 13 February 1883 )

"It had been no empty rhetoric when the German musician in his Parisian tale died professing his faith in Beethoven and Mozart. A biography of Mozart, read to him when he was only six, had made an undying impression on him."
"He was possessed by a sense of the tragedy of Mozart's life, spent 'as if under the vivisector's knife'. His finest works had been written between present exultancy and anxiety about what the next hour might bring. When Wagner saw an Adoration of the Kings in a church in Siena he exclaimed: 'All these signs of honour in childhood, shepherds and the kings and the angels - where were they later? Mozart suffered the same fate!'"
< Wagner: A Biography / Curt von Westernhagen / P. 81~82 >
 

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The net result is that it's a statement about Wagner's ideas on religion.
Don't tell me what the "net result" of my statements is. It's for me to tell you what my statements mean, and for you to listen and understand, if you can.

I disagree. As I've already explained, Wagner's "anti-Judaic" version of Christianity is essentially anti-semitic, and is included as a sub-category under the definition of antisemitism.
What you seem to be missing is that the content of a work of art has an existence apart from the contents of the artist's mind or emotions. We have no direct access to the latter. What we have is the art itself. I made a statement about Parsifal and the treatment of religious imagery it contains, and said that that imagery is not antisemitic. If Wagner had wanted it to be antisemitic he could have found a number of ways to indicate that. He did not do that. As it stands, Parsifal can be read a number of ways, and even a number of contradictory ways simultaneously. What we can say with assurance is that it's presentation of religion is unconventional and does not conform to the orthodox tenets of any religion, and that its plot strongly suggests a negative view of Judeo-Islamo-Christian religious authoritarianism. If you want to obsess over Wagner's personal views of Jews, that's your prerogative. Parsifal is not a philosophical tract, there are no statements about Jews in it, and there is no need for anyone experiencing the opera to think about Jews. You, of course, are free to think about anything you wish.

This religious form of antisemitism was pervasive in Germany (the flawed Germanic cultural matrix), and enabled Hitler in his quest.
Many things enabled Hitler, but it would seem that Parsifal was not one of them. He was actually uncomfortable with the work - understandable, given its depiction of such ideals as compassion, redemption, humility, anti-authoritarianism and pacifism, not to mention deeper subtexts concerning sexuality and psychic integration which fascinate present-day analysts of its mythical symbols. It's quite clear that Hitler did not find any racial meanings in the work to be inspired by, and though Parsifal was not officially banned, it was absent from Bayreuth between 1939 and 1945.
 
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