& yet another list of things that just missed out, link is on the bottom of the main list above, but HERE it is anyway...

 

Quite a disappointment, if you ask me. Hardly any avant-garde or atonal music was included at all. Poor Schoenberg gets only one spot down in 63rd while many significant names are just absent all together. Berg, Ives, Carter, Webern, Ligeti, Varese, Xenakis, Boulez, Stockhausen, etc. are all absent. Not a great representation of what the 20th century of music comprised of.

 

And Schoenberg's piece was written in 1899. It's a disgrace!

 

^^ABC Classic FM hardly plays new music, there's only one program, I think & it's late at night. So the listeners don't get much exposure to it, even newer music from post 1945 by dead composers. So no chance there, they might have heard those names but I'm not sure if they've heard their actual music. Heck, to some people I know, listeners for many years, even Arnold Bax does not ring a bell. Seriously. So how would those other guys get even a slight chance? Very small to no chance actually...

 

That's a good point. Since the radio station directly influences the voters' choices it makes me wonder why they even bother making a list in the first place. I'm sure listing their most frequently played pieces would yield a fairly similar result.

Also, I saw Jenkins and Lloyd Webber in the top 100. :lol: :lol: :lol:

 

I liked seeing Rodrigo's Concierto de Aranjuez so high up ... other than that I can't say I really cared for that list.

 

SID JAMES!!! You beat me to it! I was going to make this thread!

 

Good, we can have a gripe about it, and lists in general then, :lol:.

..Happy that the Stockhausen Helicopter String Quartet got in this one!

...

I think it got in more for it's notoreity than anything. I think most people don't know or can't name other Stockhausen works. I quite like his Tierkreis, very fun and theatrical, but that's not as "sexy" as the helicopter piece.

I hate the Elgar cello concerto. It really gets on my nerves, I don't know WHY, but I just can't stand it. The same way Richard Gill can't stand Gian Carlo Menotti!

I prefer Elgar's chamber music, esp. his string quartet. I don't know, don't think I've heard anything of Menotti.

 

I hate the Elgar cello concerto. It really gets on my nerves, I don't know WHY, but I just can't stand it. The same way Richard Gill can't stand Gian Carlo Menotti!

 

The classic 100 20th century was basically 80% romantic music. Numbers 101-200 seem better though. Happy that the Stockhausen Helicopter String Quartet got in this one!

Still no Brett Dean though…

101, BERG, A - Violin Concerto
102, BARTOK, B - Music for Strings, Percussion & Celeste
103, GRAINGER, P - Handel in the Strand (Clog Dance), after Handel's 'The Harmonious Blacksmith'
104, WALTON, W - Belshazzer's Feast
105, BRUCH, M - Konzertstk for violin and orchestra in F sharp minor, Op. 84
106, SHOSTAKOVICH, D - Piano Concerto No.2 in F Op.102
107, PART, A - Tabula Rasa
108, RUTTER, J - A Gaelic Blessing, 'Deep Peace'
109, SHOSTAKOVICH, D - Piano Trio No.2 in e minor Op.67
110, RODRIGO, J - Fantasia para un Gentilhombre
111, DVORAK, A - Rusalka
112, EDWARDS, R - Symphony No.1 Da pacem Domine
113, GLASS, P - Glassworks
114, SCULTHORPE, P - Earth Cry
115, VAUGHAN WILLIAMS, R - Symphony No.5 in D
116, WILLIAMS, J - Star Wars
117, PROKOFIEV, S - Piano Concerto No.3 In C Op.26
118, DEBUSSY, C - Nocturnes
119, JARRETT, K - The Koln Concert
120, SHOSTAKOVICH, D - Cello Concerto No.1 In E-flat Op.107
121, CAGE, J - 4'33"
122, DELIUS, F - On Hearing the First Cuckoo in Spring
123, FALLA, M de - Nights in the Gardens of Spain
124, RUTTER, J - Requiem
125, SHOSTAKOVICH, D - String Quartet No. 8 in C minor, Op. 110
126, SHOSTAKOVICH, D - Symphony No.11 in g minor Op.103, 'The Year 1905'
127, PART, A. - Fratres
128, JANACEK, L - Sinfonietta
129, SCULTHORPE, P - Left Bank Waltz
130, RUTTER, J - For the Beauty of the Earth
131, ALBENIZ, I - Iberia
132, KOEHNE, G - To His Servant Bach
133, RACHMANINOFF, S - vocalise
134, RAVEL, M - Le Tombeau de Couperin
135, COATES, E - The Dambusters March
136, NYMAN, M - The Heart Asks Pleasure First from 'The Piano'
137, GRAINGER, P - Country Gardens
138, ENESCU, G - Romanian Rhapsody No. 1 in A major, Op. 11
139, SHOSTAKOVICH, D - Suite for Jazz Orchestra No.2
140, PIAZZOLLA, A. - Le Grand Tango
141, PIAZZOLLA, A. - Libertango
142, SHOSTAKOVICH, D - Violin Concerto No.1 In a minor Op.77
143, DEBUSSY, C - Children's Corner (incl. Golliwogg's Cakewalk)
144, COPLAND, A - Rodeo
145, PARRY, H - I Was Glad
146, BARTOK, B. - Romanian Folk Dances
147, JOPLIN, S - The Entertainer
148, MAHLER, G - Symphony No.7 in e minor
149, POULENC, F - Organ Concerto in G minor
150, SHOSTAKOVICH, D - 24 Preludes and Fugues Op.87
151, SHOSTAKOVICH, D - Piano Concerto No.1 In c minor Op.35 (for Piano, Trumpet, and Strings)
152, STRAVINSKY, I - Symphony of Psalms
153, VAUGHAN WILLIAMS, R - Symphony No.1, 'A Sea Symphony'
154, RAVEL, M - Piano Trio in a minor
155, SCULTHORPE, P - Sun Music III
156, JAMES, W - Australian Christmas Carols
157, DEBUSSY, C - Images
158, GROFE - Grand Canyon Suite
159, STRAUSS, R - Salome [Includes 'Ich habe deinen Mund gekusst, Jokanaan']
160, KHACHATURIAN, A - Masquerade
161, RAVEL, M - Piano Concerto for the Left Hand
162, RACHMANINOFF, S - Symphonic Dances, Op. 45
163, EDWARDS, R - Oboe Concerto
164, ELGAR, E - Introduction and Allegro for strings
165, RAVEL, M - La Valse
166, MORRICONE, E - The Good, The Bad, and The Ugly
167, FANSHAWE, D - African Sanctus
168, DURUFLE, M - Requiem Op 9
169, GLASS, P - Einstein on the Beach
170, PENDERECKI, K - Threnody for the Victims of Hiroshima
171, TAVENER, J - The Protecting Veil
172, STOCKHAUSEN, K - Helicopter String Quartet
173, BRITTEN, B - A Midsummer Night's Dream
174, KHACHATURIAN, A - Gayane
175, REICH, S - Different Trains
176, RODRIGO, J - Concierto Andaluz
177, VINE, C - Piano Concerto
178, GLASS, P - Mad Rush
179, GLASS, P - Metamorphosis
180, PROKOFIEV, S - Violin Concerto No. 1 in D, Op. 19
181, SHOSTAKOVICH, D - Piano Quintet in g minor Op.57
182, SIBELIUS, J - Valse Triste
183, KOEHNE, G - Inflight Entertainment
184, RUTTER, J - The Lord Bless You and Keep You
185, BRITTEN, B - Simple Symphony
186, KORNGOLD, E - Die Tote Stadt
187, STRAUSS, R - Metamorphosen
188, VAUGHAN WILLIAMS, R - Symphony No.3, 'A Pastoral Symphony'
189, PROKOFIEV, S. - Piano Concerto No. 2
190, SPARKE, P. - Dance Movements
191, CRUMB, G - Black Angels
192, GLASS, P - Symphony No.4, 'Heroes'
193, KHACHATURIAN, A - Violin Concerto in D minor
194, RAVEL, M - Gaspard de la Nuit: Trois poemes pour piano d'apres Aloysius Bertran
195, RAVEL, M - Introduction and Allegro for Harp, Flute, Clarinet and String Quartet
196, WALTON, W - Facade
197, BRUCH, M - Serenade Op.75 for Violin and Orchestra
198, SIBELIUS, J - Symphony No. 3 in C major, Op. 52
199, WESTLAKE, N - Missa Solis
200, KATS-CHERNIN, E - Russian Rag

 

121, CAGE, J - 4'33"

My hero at last at #121 with his best piece. I am so relieved.

 

This is an interesting graph on the year each piece in the top 100 was composed. Take note of the trend line.

 

:lol: In my line, we call it spurious correlation (referring to the trend line above).

 

I think everyone here at TC would have serious issues with the Top 100 list, but the Top 100 list did not surprise me much. I think it shows what I and many others here believe - TC members are outliers in the classical music listening community. We are very unusual listeners. Most people here would say we are unusual because we have greatly more knowledge and experience listening. That may be true; nevertheless, our tastes differ (vastly?) from the norm. I do not view the list as a disgrace but rather simply an expression of the average classical music listeners tastes.

I do find the next 100 selections interesting. I would not have thought that an average group of listeners would select PENDERECKI, K - Threnody for the Victims of Hiroshima, STOCKHAUSEN, K - Helicopter String Quartet, or CRUMB, G - Black Angels in any list. I'd be shocked if the station ever played those works. Presumably there are a modest number of listeners who have significantly "expanded" tastes but listen to that station for lack of something "better".

 

I do find the next 100 selections interesting. I would not have thought that an average group of listeners would select PENDERECKI, K - Threnody for the Victims of Hiroshima, STOCKHAUSEN, K - Helicopter String Quartet, or CRUMB, G - Black Angels in any list. I'd be shocked if the station ever played those works. Presumably there are a modest number of listeners who have significantly "expanded" tastes but listen to that station for lack of something "better".

Actually I remember ABC broadcasting "Black Angels" on a couple of occasions.

 

I think you'll find "mmsbls" that probably only 2 or 3 people voted for the Crumb and Stockhausen - the audience for ABC-FM is only comparatively small anyway. I agree with Sid and others that 'lists' are largely a waste of time, except for recording companies and their marketing strategies.

I would like to make some comments about ABC-FM in general, though. I started listening to the network when it first started in 1976 and I had just given up my job at ABC Television (prior to that I worked in the Music Department!) and was about to have my first child. I became an active listener, having decided I wanted to go to university to study music seriously as a consequence of working in their Music Department. The network, then, was 'populated' by broadcasters such as Bob Maynard - who worked in that Music Department I was talking about. It was cutting edge - nothing had been done like this before on radio, aided by the new FM band which delivered high quality stereo into the home. For me, it was one of the great technological innovations for decades (as a music-lover) - in many ways it still is. I befriended another broadcaster there, and we remain friends. He has since retired. BUT some time in the early 90's the network decided to go "Classic" FM and the quality of the offerings (plus the untimely demise of the amazing Martin Hibble) fell concomitantly. They decided that 'popularity' and going for a wider audience was the way to go. At that time my friend, the broadcaster, retired and I stopped listening altogether. It's just a dead bore now. So, I am not one bit surprised at their 'lists'. Next year we'll have the Sydney International Piano Competition and I WILL listen to that and have to put up with the twee warblings of Marion Arnold, in her usual breathy style of ostentatious fawning. (Pass the bucket). But I love hearing Gerard Willems.

 

I'm not that much of a fan of Marion Arnold. I love hearing Emma Ayers in the morning. Classic Breakfast with Emma Ayers is fantastic. I don't know why people write in saying they enjoy it better with Guy Noble.

In the classic 100 this year, they seem to have purposefully made the arrangements for Emma Ayers and Mairi Nicholson (aka "The Chattering Ladies") not to be on air at the same time. Not happy about that.

 

Like all lists, it's something to take with a bucket of salt.

From what I gather, the process was similar to ABC's other '100 Projects' in that the list was completely controlled by listener voting. I mostly agree with mmsbls that the list, with its heavy bias for 20th century Romantic spillover, is the list of a mainstream audience. However, the fans are dedicated enough to vote just as we might in the other periods - it's not all Symphony No. 5 and Danse Macabre - so I do think the list is somewhat indicative of both a lack of exposure to new music (radio's fault) and an unwillingness to seek it out (audience's fault).

I've seen some people elsewhere saying that the station basically has a duty to educate their listeners with more difficult 20th century music, but I think that's a bit high-and-mighty, "Here, listen to this because it's good - I don't care if you don't like it." The radio station is not oblivious to the bias of the list either, as they had a programme discussing exactly that. Remember that, like any other station, its primary purpose is entertainment, and we ought to direct any criticisms to a wider cultural problem with engagement in the arts than at any specific broadcasters.

 

I actually agree with that comment, Polednice. We need to be doing more in our schools to get kids into better quality entertainment and media - you know, the type that doesn't numb your brain. Reading? God forbid: get them away from the I-phones and other media; this won't happen without a big fight!!

I just can't believe behaviours today. Every single day on the public transport here in Vienna people are literally shouting at each other on their phones. When they aren't ringing (and those annoying ring-tones!!), they are staring at them, checking them or playing with them. When they shout so loudly I often say to my husband, "they think they're talking into a tin attached to a piece of string!".

It's all a bit of an empty dream people have bought into in their millions.

 

CoAn, the passing of Martin Hibble still saddens, although Bob Maynard remains broadcasting, after all these years.
I don't think ABC-FM is quite so bad as you make out, although I'm less happy about them playing so many 'bits and pieces' in the morning and drive slots. I heard the back third of Capriccio Espangol the other day; it's one thing to play an isolated symphonic movement, another to excise a 'bleeding chunk' of something.
I have little time for Nicholson in general; the rest are OK except for the rather unpleasant timbres to the voices of Julian Day & Christopher Lawrance.
For those outside Australia, it's Oz version of NPR/BBC; and they do have at least some programmes of new music, they do play operas complete, they do some focussing on Australian stuff too. It's a hell of a lot better than you'd get out of any commercial enterprise, that's for sure.
cheers,
GG

 

From what I've heard (and to what extent such a comparison even makes sense) ABC-FM seems more to fall somewhere in between the UK's BBC Radio 3 (flagship arts programmes with, gasp!, full works) and Classic FM (dire commercial station).

 

My radio listening is perfectly inversely correlated with the amount of CD recordings I have. When I was first discovered classical music in my early teens, I listend to a lot of ABC Classic FM, and it was a very good source of discovering and listening to classical music, by building awareness of repertoire and of course, the performing artists. Now, with a lot more experience and recordings, I don't listen to classical radio much anymore. What music I want, I buy and attend concerts for the experience instead. Maybe when I'm driving/travelling, I might have the radio on, and that's about it. The vast amount of recorded music on CD and now on Blu-ray/DVD just kills the mostly 5 minute snips they air on radio.

 

I'm certainly interested in hearing a Didgeridoo concerto. That is how I take such lists, not as definitive truth on a subject but as a way of filling gaps in your knowledge, particularly as it has a local bias.

 

Don't you mean Graham Abbott? I thought he did Keys to Music on Saturday mornings.

Oh, you've changed your post.

 

Don't you mean Graham Abbott? I thought he did Keys to Music on Saturday mornings.

I think you're right, yes it's Mr. Abbott and I will change my post, thanks...

 

Thanks for that list man!

 

^^You're welcome Science. I put this thread up because I know a number of members here like these things. Eg. comparing them to the ones you have generated on this forum.

& additionally this thread has bought some worthwhile discussion of ABC Classic FM, and radio broadcasting of classical music in general. It is interesting & of some value.

I think it's good in a way for them to have done a "top 100" of 20th century classical music. Past top 100's have been interesting to listen to, the top 100 symphony a few years back was pretty good, even for me.

Generally I'm not a list person but I am interested in them but in a less in-depth way. I am not very systematic, I just do things my own way, but I admit it's been a few decades for me being into the classical, on and off, and my parents were involved with this music, so I didn't have to start entirely from scratch, etc...

 

Yeah, things like that help me a lot. Introduce me to new stuff.

 

GraemeG, yes I detest those snippets as well!! Martin Hibble was great - a 'bon vivant', which ultimately killed him at 54 years of age. He had a heart attack as he was about to step into the shower!! My friend, the broadcaster, told me that. Yes, ABC-FM does provide some good programs - as you, Harpsichord Concerto and Sid have all suggested - and one can 'cherry pick' these. The overseas concerts are always good. But, I'm simply saying it was hugely better in the earlier days when full works were the order of the day, no 'breakfast' snippets, "Swoon" pieces or such-like. I guess my tastes and needs have changed too over the years. The new music has always been well represented with the offerings of... (oh, I've forgotten his name - he's an Australian composer and works at the Canberra School of music)..VINCENT PLUSH. (Senior's moment!). Also, Graham Abbott is one hell-of-a-broadcaster/performer/musician. I listen to his programs on my computer.

As I write this I'm looking on Arte channel a broadcast (via ORF) of a concert in the Musikverein which had me in the audience in May this year - Buchbinder and Beethoven Piano Concerto #5 where he conducted from the keyboard the Vienna Philharmonic. Sad to say, I'm leaving Vienna in 8 days.

 

I liked Simon Healey (or however you spell his name), mainly because I remember he used to (or maybe still does) broadcast more entire large scale Baroque pieces during Friday evenings (late), including Baroque opera and oratorios etc. He quited liked Handel's music.

 

Wow how long ago was that? I don't remember that ever happening.

 

Yes, Simon Healy did this. I met him in 1988 when I went over to the Adelaide Festival and I bought him a bottle of wine to thank him - taking this out to the Collinswood studio. He doesn't drink!! Anyway, he ran a program on Friday night especially dedicated to the baroque, of which he is a specialist. That was in the 80's and to the late 90's. Don't know what he's doing now as I don't really listen that much. Occasionally I'll hear him on a regular broadcast presenting overseas concerts.

My friend (whose name I won't mention) who was a presenter on that network was one of the few with a really good sense of humour. In his lunchtime programs he'd play comedy skits - "Gerald the Gorilla" and such like, as well as the music of Dire Straits. I don't think management liked it!! He also used to make me laugh referring to the French composer Jacques Ibert as "Jackie Bear"!! Yes, he could be an iconoclast. I used to ring him regularly and ask him to play this or that. He's a music critic these days and feels the same way about ABC-FM as I do.

I've looked at your profile, ComposerofAvantGarde, and I wish I had a student like you when I taught Advanced and Extension English in NSW (until 2007).