[ArtMusic]

Obviously CM is not inherently racist. Why else would the Chinese and Japanese for example, love it and manage to perform well? Trivial.

 

[millionrainbows]

Obviously CM is not inherently racist. Why else would the Chinese and Japanese for example, love it and manage to perform well? Trivial.

It is beautiful music, granted. But since you asked...European classical music of the 17th-18th century, created by European (white males), in itself represents an hierarchy of power which I am sure appeals to totalitarian governments such as the Chinese.

I should like to detail some of the aspects and implications of the paradigm of classical organisation - the orchestra. A traditional orchestra is a ranked pyramidal hierarchy of the same kind as the armies that existed contemporary to it. The hierarchy of rank is in this pattern: conductor, leader of the orchestra; section principals; section subprincipals; and, finally, rank-and-file members. Occasionally a soloist will join the upper echelons of this system; and it is implied, of course, that the composer with his intentions and aspirations has absolute, albeit temporary, control over the whole structure and its behaviour. This ranking, as does military ranking, reflects varying degrees of responsibility; conversely, it reflects varying degrees of constraint on behaviour. Ranking has another effect: like perspective in painting, it creates "focus" and "point of view." A listener is given the impression there are a foreground and a background to the music and cannot fail to notice that most of the "high-responsibility" events take place in the foreground, to which the background is an ambience or counterpoint. This is to say that the number of perceptual positions available to the listener is likely to be limited. The third observation I should like to make about the ranking system in the orchestra is this: it predicates the use of trained musicians. A trained musicians is, at the minimum, one who will produce a predictable sound given a specific instruction. His training teaches him to be capable of operating precisely like all the other members of his rank. It trains him, in fact, to subdue some of his own natural variety and thus to increase his reliability (predictability).-Brian Eno

 

[ArtMusic]

It is beautiful music, granted. But since you asked...European classical music of the 17th-18th century, created by European (white males), in itself represents an hierarchy of power which I am sure appeals to totalitarian governments such as the Chinese.

Thanks for your post, I am much enlightened by it. Thank goodness we have the Chinese Communist Party to help culture CM in China because they can draw parallels. They should also teach Chinese students how to speak 18th century German to draw on the originals.

Edit: long may that hierarchy of power continue, so we can get more support. My local "government" is seeking to sponsor children under 12 years in a scholarship for classical piano. It's great. I love it (my community is predominately white).

 

[millionrainbows]

Thanks for your post, I am much enlightened by it...

Edit: long may that hierarchy of power continue, so we can get more support. My local "government" is seeking to sponsor children under 12 years in a scholarship for classical piano. It's great. I love it (my community is predominately white).

I have no problem with that part, or "rock school," or jazz programs either. It's all good.

 

[ArtMusic]

I have no problem with that part, or "rock school," or jazz programs either. It's all good.

Wonderful, long may that continue.

 

[TwoFlutesOneTrumpet]

It is beautiful music, granted. But since you asked...European classical music of the 17th-18th century, created by European (white males), in itself represents an hierarchy of power

Yes, how inconsiderate of all those European composers of the 17th and 18th centuries to be all white and composing music that was liked by some of the aristocracy. We all bow to the apex power all too obvious when listening to a Haydn symphony.

 

[julide]

Well brian eno makes literal elevator music and background music so... Orchestras are where people come together to make music as a collective. It certainly is a lot more democratic than a white guy making music on his computer. There are hierarchies everywhere even in communes it doesn't mean it's military like.

 

[ArtMusic]

Yes, how inconsiderate of all those European composers of the 17th and 18th centuries to be all white and composing music that was liked by some of the aristocracy. We all bow to the apex power all too obvious when listening to a Haydn symphony.

:lol: exactly right. It's only those flawed university professors from the 1950's onwards and their students who want to propagate their leftist ideals. Of course we are proud of western classical music heritage. How dare they think it is racist and all that rubbish. I have never met any classical music listener convert into being a racist from listening to CM, quite the opposite.

 

[Nereffid]

I have never met any classical music listener convert into being a racist from listening to CM, quite the opposite.

By "quite the opposite", do you mean you know a racist who stopped being racist because they listened to classical music? Or you know a classical music listener who became a racist because they stopped listening to classical music?

 

[amfortas]

By "quite the opposite", do you mean you know a racist who stopped being racist because they listened to classical music? Or you know a classical music listener who became a racist because they stopped listening to classical music?

Just on the off chance it's the second, I'll make sure to play some Mozart today.

 

[Dan Ante]

This thread is a waste of space I have not seen one instance where a specific case of racism in classical music has been given.